still problems with ordering

[louis cyfer]

i tried to order my dream g&l, and i heard back from the dealer today. the rep at the factory said, no way on the no pickguard on the asat special swamp ash. i know dave stated that it was an available option. i asked about the asat special deluxe, and i was told that is only available with a hog body and maple cap. swamp ash is not possible. i also asked about getting a roasted maple neck, the rep said no tinted option with the satin finish. i wasn't aware that roasted maple was a tinting option. not the factory rep, nor the g&l dealer had a clue about roasted maple. basically it gets frustrating trying to order. i was also being told that if i don't place the order now, and wait til january, it will take up to a year to receive it. this is the second g&l dealer i am trying to go through, the first one was absolutely useless, just trying to get me to flip to prs.

the disconnect between the factory, the reps and the dealers is just scary. at this point i am considering just driving by fender ave and squeezing dave's neck until they get some sense going. of course, i can't just talk to someone at the factory who actually knows what's going on, and place an order, that would be too easy.

[willross]

That sounds like an order I'd make. Although, I'd rather get the GbL2 and roasted neck.


Cheers,

Will

[jonc]

This seems to be a problem that has plagued G&L for a very long time and why it hasn't be resolved is beyond me. As having solid coordination between dealers, reps and the factory is key to an operation like G&L. To be fair other companies have similar issues but I remember a few years back going into music shops around the country that had once carried G&L saying they would no longer do so just for this issue. Of course sales folks at many stores can be out to lunch as well. Not sure if you've contacted John at Buffalo Brothers, but I've always found them to be very helpful, and they have a very good working relationship with the factory. That said, Dave and team really need to address this once and for all. Or perhaps they have all the orders and sales they need and this is not a problem for them? Good luck on getting the G&L you want. Sounds like a great mix of options, and it would be a shame if you were unable to get the exact guitar you want due to a disconnect or just plain incompetency.

[louis cyfer]

This seems to be a problem that has plagued G&L for a very long time and why it hasn't be resolved is beyond me. As having solid coordination between dealers, reps and the factory is key to an operation like G&L. To be fair other companies have similar issues but I remember a few years back going into music shops around the country that had once carried G&L saying they would no longer do so just for this issue. Of course sales folks at many stores can be out to lunch as well. Not sure if you've contacted John at Buffalo Brothers, but I've always found them to be very helpful, and they have a very good working relationship with the factory. That said, Dave and team really need to address this once and for all. Or perhaps they have all the orders and sales they need and this is not a problem for them? Good luck on getting the G&L you want. Sounds like a great mix of options, and it would be a shame if you were unable to get the exact guitar you want due to a disconnect or just plain incompetency.

the dealer i am working with now is very good in every other area, the sales guy has been there forever, i have known them for a long time, and they have suhr and dussenberg, anderson, and many other good guitar brands. i either get the guitar the way i want it, or i call ron kirn and he'll make me one the way i want it.

i will only deal with stores local to me. i pay cash, and i pick up the guitar in person, at the g&l factory, i don't want it shipped anywhere. i would be very sad if it didn't work out.

[y2kc]

Mr. Cyfer,
They make a good guitar if you want what they are offering. As a contrast, I have a guitar being built by another builder right now and they have wanted my input all the way. I was even allowed to change the body shape a tad. This is a big company that everyone has heard of and everyone respects. Knob positions, ebony board, body wood,p-u's, color- these were my choices. I call the factory, they answer the phone and that's how it is done. I am just a customer that wants what they build.

Why can't G&L build a guitar just the way you want it?


y2kc

[willross]

or i call ron kirn and he'll make me one the way i want it.

I hear ya. I'm looking at a Barn Buster Custom... Still want a GbL2 and dig where we went with the spec.


Cheers,

Will

[Darth Invader]

Guys,

I started typing a reply but it keeps getting garbled.

Same old thing. Loads of options on the price list but we get a request here and there for something not on there, we do it, then it causes more confusion later. Some of the things can't be just tossed in the price list without carefully thinking them through, and believe me, sometimes that becomes a mess. You can do this with that but not that other thing, or only when together with that, and pricing it is this minus that but only if you already have that over there.

Sometimes we do special things, making it clear it's not a regular thing, and it gets interpreted as though its an option and dealers should know about it. Take the roasted maple: we made a few protos with it and that was that. It's not an option and I've no intention, at least for now, of making it an option. The GbL LE is spec'd with that, and I can take care of it, but that still doesn't make it an option.

Saying "yes" to the one-off request here and there probably causes more confusion than it's worth. It's one thing to clear that particular example, but we have to think carefully about just tossing it in the price list. A lot of things can get complex and need to be thought through carefully.

I guess I'll have to do some more thinking about this. If indeed it's that much of a mess, I guess the safest path is to stick with "no" on anything that isn't in the price list. At least there will be no uncertainty.

Dave

[willross]

Dave,

Thanks for the clarification. That makes sense; testing the waters w/ new ideas, but not adopting... yet. Also thanks for the mention of the GbL LE. I really wanted one for Grammy week, but the S-500/Soldano works too...


Cheers,

Will

[louis cyfer]

Guys,

I started typing a reply but it keeps getting garbled.

Same old thing. Loads of options on the price list but we get a request here and there for something not on there, we do it, then it causes more confusion later. Some of the things can't be just tossed in the price list without carefully thinking them through, and believe me, sometimes that becomes a mess. You can do this with that but not that other thing, or only when together with that, and pricing it is this minus that but only if you already have that over there.

Sometimes we do special things, making it clear it's not a regular thing, and it gets interpreted as though its an option and dealers should know about it. Take the roasted maple: we made a few protos with it and that was that. It's not an option and I've no intention, at least for now, of making it an option. The GbL LE is spec'd with that, and I can take care of it, but that still doesn't make it an option.

Saying "yes" to the one-off request here and there probably causes more confusion than it's worth. It's one thing to clear that particular example, but we have to think carefully about just tossing it in the price list. A lot of things can get complex and need to be thought through carefully.

I guess I'll have to do some more thinking about this. If indeed it's that much of a mess, I guess the safest path is to stick with "no" on anything that isn't in the price list. At least there will be no uncertainty.

Dave

i am fine without the roasted maple. it was just sad to see that they had no idea what it was. but the no pickguard is not negotiable. and we have been told here that is available. by you. i think having a knowledgeable person, instead just a bureaucrat that's looking at a sheet of paper would be better. the just say no is not the best answer to go about this.

[Darth Invader]

Now I might get myself in trouble again, but...

A USA ASAT Special (not a Special Deluxe) has no routing under the pickguard so yes, the pickguard can be deleted without leaving some unattractive wire routes. I qualified that with the USA model because I think the Tribute Series version has a diagonal route to facilitate wire placement.

The rep, not knowing what roasted maple is, somehow got wires crossed with finishing. We have successfully done tinting with satin rather than gloss. There is good chance that we will have light tint with satin in the next price list for January. I can't promise that, as we've not really dug into it.

Might be a good idea to hold off on this until then. I'll have to put the pickguard delete idea in the hopper to get sussed out, though I'm pretty sure it would be restricted to certain ASAT models. If it turns out the tint/satin neck finish is a go on the price list but not the pickguard delete for some reason, we can waive that one through.

Dave

[Darth Invader]

i am fine without the roasted maple. it was just sad to see that they had no idea what it was. but the no pickguard is not negotiable. and we have been told here that is available. by you. i think having a knowledgeable person, instead just a bureaucrat that's looking at a sheet of paper would be better. the just say no is not the best answer to go about this.

The problem still remains: a dealer shouldn't have to call to find out what's available, the price list should tell him that. The price list is prepared by the knowledgeable people, based on what we reasonably think we can offer at a price that makes it worthwhile, with enough demand expected to keep it in the line. Theoretically, at least. We've already got so many options in the price list which are rarely taken and there is a cost to keeping them there, and it's not just the ink on the price list.

[louis cyfer]

Now I might get myself in trouble again, but...

A USA ASAT Special (not a Special Deluxe) has no routing under the pickguard so yes, the pickguard can be deleted without leaving some unattractive wire routes. I qualified that with the USA model because I think the Tribute Series version has a diagonal route to facilitate wire placement.

The rep, not knowing what roasted maple is, somehow got wires crossed with finishing. We have successfully done tinting with satin rather than gloss. There is good chance that we will have light tint with satin in the next price list for January. I can't promise that, as we've not really dug into it.

Might be a good idea to hold off on this until then. I'll have to put the pickguard delete idea in the hopper to get sussed out, though I'm pretty sure it would be restricted to certain ASAT models. If it turns out the tint/satin neck finish is a go on the price list but not the pickguard delete for some reason, we can waive that one through.

Dave

that is good news. the light tint with satin would be nice. i am looking at the usa asat special in swamp ash, and it would be criminal to cover up the beautiful woods you use. is there a chance of nena getting on the finish option list? also, can i specifically request a light piece of wood for the body? i know the ash varies greatly.

[Darth Invader]

that is good news. the light tint with satin would be nice. i am looking at the usa asat special in swamp ash, and it would be criminal to cover up the beautiful woods you use. is there a chance of nena getting on the finish option list? also, can i specifically request a light piece of wood for the body? i know the ash varies greatly.

I can understand how you feel about covering up the wood. It can be a little iffy aesthetically for a lot of guys, having the control plate but no pickguard. We're sort of testing that vibe with the Black Ice Bluesboy but I don't see us having any NENA finishes on the price list for January. This is another one where it really needs to be thought through, plus it wouldn't be right to offer the same Honey Ale or Black Ice right on the heels of a Special Collection thing. We've tinkered with a couple of other colors but so far I'm not impressed. The Honey Ale and Black Ice really work and I'm pretty sure we'll find others, but I want to see something that blows me away, not just "meh."

So there needs to be more tinkering before we find something else that really works, and then we'd have to structure the price list to allow for it just on swamp ash bodies. Or, we've got one NENA that can work on this and that wood but another that's only good for swamp ash Therein lies some of that complexity: which models can it be had on and so forth... the devil is always ready for us to screw up the price list. At the same time, the guys have some other stuff to get fully baked before NAMM so I have to be mindful not to throw more at them.

The formal answer on requesting a light piece of wood is "no." I'd like to develop some system to deal with custom weight specifications, but when we get to "light" that's pretty subjective and we're at the mercy of available supply. We've got some great suppliers but even they can't know for sure how good the harvest is until the logs come in. All that said, you might want ask your dealer to tag that note on to the order. Uh oh, I'm gonna get myself in trouble again. ; )

[Darth Invader]

Dave,

Thanks for the clarification. That makes sense; testing the waters w/ new ideas, but not adopting... yet. Also thanks for the mention of the GbL LE. I really wanted one for Grammy week, but the S-500/Soldano works too...


Cheers,

Will

Believe me, Patrick has been on this thing. : )

[louis cyfer]

that is good news. the light tint with satin would be nice. i am looking at the usa asat special in swamp ash, and it would be criminal to cover up the beautiful woods you use. is there a chance of nena getting on the finish option list? also, can i specifically request a light piece of wood for the body? i know the ash varies greatly.

I can understand how you feel about covering up the wood. It can be a little iffy aesthetically for a lot of guys, having the control plate but no pickguard. We're sort of testing that vibe with the Black Ice Bluesboy but I don't see us having any NENA finishes on the price list for January. This is another one where it really needs to be thought through, plus it wouldn't be right to offer the same Honey Ale or Black Ice right on the heels of a Special Collection thing. We've tinkered with a couple of other colors but so far I'm not impressed. The Honey Ale and Black Ice really work and I'm pretty sure we'll find others, but I want to see something that blows me away, not just "meh."

So there needs to be more tinkering before we find something else that really works, and then we'd have to structure the price list to allow for it just on swamp ash bodies. Or, we've got one NENA that can work on this and that wood but another that's only good for swamp ash Therein lies some of that complexity: which models can it be had on and so forth... the devil is always ready for us to screw up the price list. At the same time, the guys have some other stuff to get fully baked before NAMM so I have to be mindful not to throw more at them.

The formal answer on requesting a light piece of wood is "no." I'd like to develop some system to deal with custom weight specifications, but when we get to "light" that's pretty subjective and we're at the mercy of available supply. We've got some great suppliers but even they can't know for sure how good the harvest is until the logs come in. All that said, you might want ask your dealer to tag that note on to the order. Uh oh, I'm gonna get myself in trouble again. ; )

i already have the bluesboy with control plate and no pickguard, and the look works. thanks for all the input, it is really appreciated.

[willross]

Dave,

Thanks for the clarification. That makes sense; testing the waters w/ new ideas, but not adopting... yet. Also thanks for the mention of the GbL LE. I really wanted one for Grammy week, but the S-500/Soldano works too...


Cheers,

Will

Believe me, Patrick has been on this thing. : )

I dig it. Let me know if you'll be in LA for G Week...


Cheers,

Will

[Darth Invader]

I dig it. Let me know if you'll be in LA for G Week...

What's this, Will? I may be having brain fade.

[louis cyfer]

I dig it. Let me know if you'll be in LA for G Week...

What's this, Will? I may be having brain fade.

i think he is referring to grammy week from his earlier post. of course that doesn't eliminate the brain fade
otoh, i really appreciate you being involved and addressing the situation. i have talked to the dealer, told him the no pg should be a go, and we'll wait til january for the tinted satin (which should be very popular).

[willross]

The dragon man is right. I'll be in town to attend the Musicares dinner and Awards telecast as well as a few NARAS gigs. It'll be a lot of fun.


Cheers,

Will

[meowmix]

I hear ya. I'm looking at a Barn Buster Custom... Still want a GbL2 and dig where we went with the spec.

Cheers,

Will

WoW! That Barn Buster has some beautiful wood covered up with a pick guard.