Experiences with Stainless vs Nickel fretwire

[NickHorne]

I'd be really interested to get a discussion up on the pros / cons of Stainless vs Nickel frets.
I remember once meeting a Parker with stainless on, and this felt and sounded good.
BUT: this was a humbucker guitar, and I'm really based in a single-coil, hottish-end-of-country tele zone. What harder frets do to the sonic niceties of this kind of playing is an intriguing unknown to me. I know I do fancy being able to bend (a lot) with less drag and less wear.
Does stainless have negative aspects from a luthier's POV? Like being difficult to seat into a fingerboard, and subsequently bedding-in in a less benign fashion?
And what about the end result, the sound of what we play? Does anyone feel it adds to any kind of unwanted noises, or hard edges added to hammers / pulloffs, or anything like that?
It seems like a real no-brainer to just use stainless, but something is telling me it may not be that simple.....

[sirmyghin]

I have noticed no timbre change based on fret material, but I really like SS frets. They never wear when I play them, 3 years strong and not a mark, still as smooth as the day I got them. They are harder on tools, no more difficult to seat. I have them on my bass and my non G&L guitar (would be on my G&L too if they had introduced/let me have them 6 months before they introduced them). You really can't beat the feel of them, bends are especially wonderful.

A lot of folks will go on an on about how there is more string noise and they are brighter, I don't buy it, nor have I experienced it. I put it up there with the placebo affect wood has, they make up their minds before they listen.

[jonc]

i have stainless on 2 guitars and like the feel of them a lot. i also have not noticed any sonic difference other than the fact that since the frets feel smoother to me than nickel, i sometimes overshoot where i'm going. sorry i don't have anything scientific to offer and i know my tech hates em (along with the Buzz Feiten tuning system), but given the longevity of SS and the feel/wear factor, they'll be my first pick for a refret or if i ever buy new.

[ieso]

Don't let anyone talk you out of SS frets. Amazing! Anybody who says they sound different can't prove it.

[willross]

SS frets ARE brighter. W/out an oscilloscope, I cannot provide evidence. But hey, do your own side-by-side (plugged in too) and you'll hear it. Nickel silver is a family of copper-zinc-nickel alloys and is denser than stainless steel. While many things affect the sound of a guitar/bass, this is one of the more noticeable aspects. I could go on, but then I'd be getting into "rant" territory. No thanks...


Cheers,

Will

Edit: While SS frets are brighter, that doesn't mean not-as-good. The smoothness, fast action, and wear resistance are great features. Also, what do we base a "good sound" on? It's all relative.

[NickHorne]

I think my interpretation would be that better mechanical coupling of string-to-fingerboard, possibly increasing brightness and sustain, would be completely positive.
But noises-off would be very negative - I'm imagining perhaps new mechanical sounds getting added as the string makes contact with the fret, and also when it parts contact; maybe a sort of "ching" or "ting" added to hammer-ons and pulloffs, or even to regular fretting sounds. Now that is the kind of thing that gets exposed in recording, and the guilty instrument doesn't get forgiven... they wouldn't have to be loud in order to get really irritating.
Any thoughts along these kinds of lines?

[darwinohm]

I have only one Stainless Fret guitar in the mess that I have and wish they were all Stainless. It is a Parker Southern (Tele Style). They sound great, feel great, and do not wear out by me, and I have others with minimal play that show some fretware, especially vintage fretwire.-- Darwin

[NickHorne]

That's encouraging!
Would you guess that they would still be benign in the more stringy / shiny end of Tele territory, where the quality of the attack of notes is quite important?
I hope I'm wrong, but I just fear "liquid" being replaced by "rigid"; my "steel" bends acquiring the sound of some actual "metal"!
But I do wish I wasn't looking at the wear I inflict developing visibly week by week.
Have to vote on this soon with my wallet, from a far - off land, and all advice is sincerely appreciated.

[darwinohm]

Nick, I know that there are some on this forum that have new G&Ls with stainless frets. Maybe they will give us an assessment.-- Darwin

[sirmyghin]

That's encouraging!
Would you guess that they would still be benign in the more stringy / shiny end of Tele territory, where the quality of the attack of notes is quite important?
I hope I'm wrong, but I just fear "liquid" being replaced by "rigid"; my "steel" bends acquiring the sound of some actual "metal"!
But I do wish I wasn't looking at the wear I inflict developing visibly week by week.
Have to vote on this soon with my wallet, from a far - off land, and all advice is sincerely appreciated.

Your bends will actually have less metal, as you will lose any scratch the nickel frets may have acquired over time, same goes for vibrato. You must be murder on frets dude, my ASAT is almost 1 and no visible wear. Maybe you should do some exercises to lighten your grip a bit, you don't need to slam it around, just touch enough to make the string sound.

[NickHorne]

My grip's really gentle.
For example, "Nashville West" has whole-tone bends at the second fret, three times per bar for half of the duration the piece.
My Asat's 4 and my frets aren't showing that much wear that it's a big issue. And the strings are stainless!
It's the smoothness of bending (and therefore pitching accuracy) that interests me about stainless. That and how the slower rate of wear might help keep the crowns in an easy-playing shape.
I'm starting to get a mental picture of the sound factor, though still not sure about contact / parting contact noises.
Anyone with a Stainless G&L want to offer their impressions? I'm thinking of a Classic, for bender Tele duty.

[sirmyghin]

I play my bass, which has SS frets touch style and I have no unwanted noise. I hammer every note (no pull offs). On my guitar I can bend 2 steps in a fairly easy manner.

[NickHorne]

Thanks!
Nothing like a huge spread of opinion on a really important question..

[sirmyghin]

Thanks!
Nothing like a huge spread of opinion on a really important question..

I may be getting my interface back today when I jam (depends if he is done with it), I could do a quick recording of some tapping if you would like, unfortunately I don't have a quality bass with not SS frets to run it against. So any comparison would be pretty faulty (as it is not me doing it)

[NickHorne]

That's generous of you to offer, though I don't think I'll be able to estimate how an Asat Classic might be affected from listening to a bass.
And what I'll be doing with it will be a very long way from tapping, much more old-school B-bender and general Country-Rock and Americana Tele.
But thank you most sincerely for offering, that's really thoughtful of you!
And I'm encouraged by what you wrote about "no unwanted noises". Thanks for that too.
Best
Nick

[darwinohm]

Nick, I took my Parker Nitefly out this morning and gave it a test drive. Playing SS frets is like playing a guitar with new frets. I have been told by some that the pickups in the Parker (SDs) were compensated to cut down on brightness due to SS frets. I do not know if this is true but that could be compensated for in your amp. I love them. -- Darwin

[sirmyghin]

That's generous of you to offer, though I don't think I'll be able to estimate how an Asat Classic might be affected from listening to a bass.
And what I'll be doing with it will be a very long way from tapping, much more old-school B-bender and general Country-Rock and Americana Tele.
But thank you most sincerely for offering, that's really thoughtful of you!
And I'm encouraged by what you wrote about "no unwanted noises". Thanks for that too.
Best
Nick

My point was more tapping/touchstyle is going to be the style with the largest amount of fret noise, every note is a hammer on. If it isn't a problem there, regular playing will be just fine. Especially when tapping in the upper register as you are fighting the higher action then. throwing 45 lb strings 3-4 mm in a blink all the time requires some bit of force

[NickHorne]

Gotcha. Thanks!

Now these guys are also making me feel more confident:
http://flatpick.ning.com/forum/topics/s ... teel-frets

Putting them on D28's??? That's endorsement!!

+ (quick edit) just seen this too:
http://www.alliedlutherie.com/fretwire.htm

Not exactly my "Clarence" Tele territory, but pretty solid encouragement just the same.