1993 Legacy

[Grem]

I bought a used 93 Legacy. Belair Green!!

I have had it about a year and just noticed that the volume knob is a push/pull pot!!

Tried to figure out what it does, but best I can tell is that it only affects the last three switch positions.

Anyone know any info on this? Did it come like this? Or was it modded?

[SouthpawGuy]

Just a guess but if it only affects the last three positions it is the same as the "expander" switch on an S500 .. i.e. it combines the bridge and neck pickups. Can't say I've heard of it done that way from the factory, using a push pull on the volume knob.

[pauliewalnuts]

Switch to the bridge pickup only. Tap all pickups with screwdriver, see which are on. Now pull up the pot and do the same.
My guess is you'll get the neck pickup & bridge pickup in the up position (switch in bridge position), and all 3 when you switch to the #4 switch position. Mid pickup should be by itself, all 3 in # 2 position again, and neck & bridge again in the neck position. Or some combination of that...good luck

[bassman]

To answer your question. It didn't come from the factory that way. Someone modified it and it probably does what the others suggested- that is join the bridge and neck pickup so that you have the option for those 2 pus or all three.
BTW- That is an early model Legacy and it probably has Seymour Duncan Pickups in it and Japanese pots, unless they were replaced by the modify guy.
I have one and they are very nice guitarts
Test it out and let us know.

[Grem]

Wow.. It's hard to realize that I started this thread so long ago. But I do have more info on this guitar. I pulled the neck off and found out it's a 1992, not a 93!!

And I believe that someone made some changes to it. The push/pull knob is actually a Double coil/single coil switch for the Dimarzio Super Distortion (single coil shape/stacked)! Yep, that's what I recent figured out when I pulled it all apart to look at the date in the neck pocket. It also has four cap in there too!! And the way they are wired up is something I haven't come across.

It also has what looks like a copper plate on the bottom of the pot cavity with several ground wires soldered to it. Not sure what that's about either. Anyone knows if that plate came standard?

Here are some pics if you want to see:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xjTJjq ... sp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xdeKru ... sp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xZIPS3 ... sp=sharing

[sam]

Hey Grem!

Very cool information indeed and thanks for sharing. None years on and still loving the Legacy it looks like.

Those old DiMarzio Super Distortions are sweet pups. I take it blends well with the CLF’s or are neck and bridge others?

[Kevin GnL]

Hi Grem,

It's nice that you still have the guitar after 9 years. The early Legacys have quite a few differences from the later ones, something that I learned from a post on another forum; I will look for the link and post it, otherwise I'll add some details to this thread.

From your photos, you seem to have the original dark-green caps (presumably on the original pots, not the volume pot, obviously) and original switch.

The copper plate on the bottom of the pot cavity is original; there should also be one in the jack socket cavity. These were for grounding: iirc, the vibrato block was wired to the pot cavity plate that itself was wired to the jack socket plate. On mine (a November 1992 model) the ground prong of the jack socket was in contact with the copper plate. There may have been one or two other wires connected to the plates, I can't remember (no longer own it), but I do recall that there was no ground wire between the 3 pot cases, it's possible that these also touched the copper plate when sitting in place.

Kevin.

p.s. here is the thread showing the differences between early and later Legacys

https://www.harmonycentral.com/forums/t ... os-inside/

When I found mine, it was on the rack next to a later model and the differences were quite remarkable: mine had much deeper body contours and was, unsurprisingly, much lighter. It also had the best sunburst I have seen, perfectly blended. The finish was very thin and allowed the wood grain to be visible; I think later guitars had slightly thicker finishes.

[Grem]

if it only affects the last three positions it is the same as the "expander" switch on an S500 .. i.e. it combines the bridge and neck pickups.

Thanks for that info. Using Pauliewalnuts method I was able to figure out this is exactly what it does. Thanks for the comment.

[Grem]

Switch to the bridge pickup only. Tap all pickups with screwdriver, see which are on. Now pull up the pot and do the same.

you'll get the neck pickup & bridge pickup in the up position (switch in bridge position), and all 3 when you switch to the #4 switch position. Mid pickup should be by itself, all 3 in # 2 position again, and neck & bridge again in the neck position. Or some combination of that...good luck

This is what I found out. It is some combo of the above. Haven't figured out exactly what it does, but all three pups come on in the #4 position with vol pulled up. (#1 being by pups,#5 toward the floor) #1 and #2 position act just like any other Strat: Neck and Middle combined. #3 is middle pup by itself. But it is louder when in this position.

I will post back with more info in the next several days once I get it wrote down what they do.

Again thanks for your help.

[Grem]

Hey Grem!

Very cool information indeed and thanks for sharing. None years on and still loving the Legacy it looks like.

Those old DiMarzio Super Distortions are sweet pups. I take it blends well with the CLF’s or are neck and bridge others?

Yes I am loving this guitar. I have recently looked at the pups and wanted to get pics of the wiring in it. It's always had a little cutting out in it since I got it. I just thought it was the volume pot needing to be cleaned. So I recently took it apart and did just that, cleaned all the pots out. But what I found that was causing the cutting out was a wire that needed to be resoldered. I just happened to be looking at the wire when it came off. Must have been like that since it was modified. Never really had a good solder job done to it. So I fixed that. Working well now.

That Super Distortion pup is something else. I played it before I made the purchase and only played it clean just to make sure everything worked. Wasn't till I got it home and put it through the paces that I realized she was a beast!!

I only recently found out about the Dimarzio in there. The guy I bought it from had got it from some guy that owed him money. He no idea what the guitar's history was.

Now the other two pups I am not sure if they are just stock pups or are Seymour Duncans like someone suggested. But they do sound great together, or on their own. I got a good one for sure!!

[Grem]

Hi Grem,

The early Legacys have quite a few differences from the later ones, something that I learned from a post on another forum;
From your photos, you seem to have the original dark-green caps (presumably on the original pots, not the volume pot, obviously) and original switch.

The copper plate on the bottom of the pot cavity is original; there should also be one in the jack socket cavity. These were for grounding: iirc, the vibrato block was wired to the pot cavity plate that itself was wired to the jack socket plate. On mine (a November 1992 model) the ground prong of the jack socket was in contact with the copper plate. There may have been one or two other wires connected to the plates, I can't remember (no longer own it), but I do recall that there was no ground wire between the 3 pot cases, it's possible that these also touched the copper plate when sitting in place.

Kevin.

The Soldering job on those caps are much better than the soldering job on that volume pot!! So I am like you, that must be still the original stuff there.

I love the deep cuts of the body contour for the belly and the forearm. It's like it just wraps around you.

And yes that cooper plate has ground wires attached to it. I haven't taken the jack plate off, so I am not sure that it still has a plate in there.

What is an S500? IS that a early G&L?

[Kevin GnL]

Seems like you are getting things sorted with it, Grem.

Just wondering what prompted your S-500 question (it is a G&L guitar, I don't know much about them, I think it was the predecessor to the Legacy before BBE bought the company), I don't think I mentioned it?

Kevin.

p.s. I've just seen S-500 mentioned in relation to your volume switch query.

[Grem]

Just wondering what prompted your S-500 question (it is a G&L guitar, I don't know much about them, I think it was the predecessor to the Legacy before BBE bought the company),

The is also a S-500 wrote in pencil on the neck heel of my Legacy. So when someone mentioned the S-500 it got me wondering.... why would my neck have that on it?

If you look back at the pics I recently posted, it's the second link, that's the neck pic. And you can clearly see S 500 with no hyphen.

[Kevin GnL]

I noticed that when I first looked at your photos and wondered if it was originally made during the Leo-era, destined for an S-500, but repurposed by BBE for their new model? As I wrote, I'm not au fait with the S500, so I'm sure you can find out, loads of info at https://www.ggjaguar.com/gnl.htm and http://yowhatsshakin.com/yowhatsshakin/ ... ction.html

Kevin

[Craig]

I contacted Memo (G&L Service Manager) and asked him to lookup your guitar in the factory logs.
Here is his reply:

Hi Craig,
our records show this is belair green Legacy completion date is March 23, 1992 rosewood fretboard 1 5/8" nut with 12" radius, all the best.
Memo

Hope this helps.

[Grem]

I contacted Memo (G&L Service Manager) and asked him to lookup your guitar in the factory logs.
Here is his reply:

Hi Craig,
our records show this is belair green Legacy completion date is March 23, 1992 rosewood fretboard 1 5/8" nut with 12" radius, all the best.
Memo

Hope this helps.

Wow!! Thanks a lot for doing that Craig!! Those measurements are exactly what I found. Great to confirm with factory specs.

I noticed that when I first looked at your photos and wondered if it was originally made during the Leo-era, destined for an S-500, but repurposed by BBE for their new model? As I wrote, I'm not au fait with the S500, so I'm sure you can find out, loads of info at https://www.ggjaguar.com/gnl.htm and http://yowhatsshakin.com/yowhatsshakin/ ... ction.html

Kevin

Thanks Kevin for those links. Going check them out now.

[Grem]

Wanted to update the specs on this guitar. Specifically the Push/Pull Vol -5 way switch combo.

With the Volume pushed down, all 5 positions of the switch act like a normal Strat: Neck, Neck/Middle, Middle, Middle/Bridge, Bridge.

With the Volume pulled up it goes like this:
1-Neck
2-Neck/Middle
3-Neck/Middle
4-Neck/Middle/Bridge
5-Neck/Bridge

There is no difference in position 2 and 3 when the Volume is pulled up. Anyway, nothing I can hear.

[Craig]

Wanted to update the specs on this guitar. Specifically the Push/Pull Vol -5 way switch combo.

With the Volume pushed down, all 5 positions of the switch act like a normal Strat: Neck, Neck/Middle, Middle, Middle/Bridge, Bridge.

With the Volume pulled up it goes like this:
1-Neck
2-Neck/Middle
3-Neck/Middle
4-Neck/Middle/Bridge
5-Neck/Bridge

There is no difference in position 2 and 3 when the Volume is pulled up. Anyway, nothing I can hear.

This is wired differently than the factory Expander switching. See: What is the expander switch used on many of the models?.

[Grem]

This is wired differently than the factory Expander switching. See: What is the expander switch used on many of the models?.

Thanks for directing me to that post. I looked at the videos in the links too.

Watching the videos lets me know that someone modified this guitar. Cause if it was factory done it would have had a Tone push/pull instead of a Volume push/pull like it has.

I am wondering how can I tell if the middle and neck pups are factory/original pups?

[Craig]

This is wired differently than the factory Expander switching. See: What is the expander switch used on many of the models?.

Thanks for directing me to that post. I looked at the videos in the links too.

Watching the videos lets me know that someone modified this guitar. Cause if it was factory done it would have had a Tone push/pull instead of a Volume push/pull like it has.

I am wondering how can I tell if the middle and neck pups are factory/original pups?

Just note that the standard Legacy did not/does not come with the Pickup Expander function.
One of our members created some diagrams of Legacy wiring include one on adding the Pickup Expander feature, see:
Album: 1992-present Legacy PTB Controls.

Regarding the pickups, the stock pickups for a 1992 build would be Seymour Duncan SSL Vintage (flats).
See this post in our G&L Knowledgebase: List of pickups used in G&L guitars.
If you remove the pickguard and look at the bottom of the pickups which might be labelled. You can also check the DC-R of the pickups, if they are the
stock pickups they would have an impedance of around 6.6K. See this post for testing DC-R: Measuring Pickup DC-R

Hope this helps.

[Grem]

Just note that the standard Legacy did not/does not come with the Pickup Expander function.
One of our members created some diagrams of Legacy wiring include one on adding the Pickup Expander feature, see:
Album: 1992-present Legacy PTB Controls.

Thanks for the info about the Legacy not originally coming from the factory with that feature. I will take a look at that article. After the recent look I had under the pickguard I could see that whoever installed the push/pull volume didn't do a good soldering job. And that's surprising because the other solder jobs look factory perfect!! So I am wanting to do a little fiddling with the wiring in there.

Regarding the pickups, the stock pickups for a 1992 build would be Seymour Duncan SSL Vintage (flats).
See this post in our G&L Knowledgebase: List of pickups used in G&L guitars.
If you remove the pickguard and look at the bottom of the pickups which might be labelled. You can also check the DC-R of the pickups, if they are the
stock pickups they would an impedance of around 6.6K. See this post for testing DC-R: Measuring Pickup DC-R

The Neck and the Middle pups both have flat/even poles. The only markings they have is two stickers on each pup. One sticker says Neck or Middle, and the other stickers has "2R" on it. They only have black and white wire coming out of them. Here is a link to a pic of the two pups:
https://imgur.com/a/Q6GJRm5

Hope this helps.

You have been extremely helpful. Thank you very much for all your time and effort in helping me find out more about this great guitar!!