Questions about my new used S-500

[jackstraw]

Hi All - I found an S-500 on Reverb that I couldn't pass up -- Saddle-lock bridge and nice wide nut.

Somewhere along the line someone installed Klein 1961 pickups in it. But, I just wasn't getting the glassy tones I expected out of it. So, I checked in on this forum and found a great thread highlighting the differences between Legacy and S-500 wiriting. The thread explained that Alnico pickups might not like "C3" in this diagram http://www.glguitars.com/schematics/S-5 ... iagram.pdf, so I decided to take it out.

Taking this capacitor out made a night and day difference in the tone of the guitar. It's much glassier now, so it seems that I've finally found my hardtail beefy necked S-type guitar. Having the S-500 switch is quite a bonus, as I love the bridge + neck combination.

Now for my questions... As I looked over the wiring, I noticed that all 3 pots are 250K CTS pots. All of the capacitors match the values listed on the block diagram. But, I was surprised to see 250K pots for tone and bass instead of 500K and 1M.

Was this ever a standard stock spec?
What am I missing by using 250K pots with Alnico pickups?

Also, the writing in the pickup rout refers to #3 RW, which clearly refers to the neck. The nut width appears to be 1 3/4", so before taking the pickguard off, I would have sworn this was a #4 neck. I've read that there was a time when the #3 and #4 necks were switched on the price list. Does anybody have any guidance to help me figure out just what I have?

Serial # is CLF13515. I did not see it in the registry, but yes I plan to add it once I figure out just what I've got.

It looks like this guitar has bounced around quite a bit, but I'll be holding onto it for a while.

Thanks in advance.

[Katefan]

Congrats on your S-500!
Don't know heaps about BBE-era stuff as that's not how I roll but I do know that #3 & #4 necks mean something different pre vs. pos Leo-era so that's something to keep in mind. Leo-era #4 necks are 1 3/4" with 12" fret board radius… I have 2 axes with them and I dig the extra real estate.
As far as 250k pots - they tend to sound better for single coil pu's tho some folks prefer 1 Meg for volume controls specifically in tele's. I believe CBS Fender changed to them after 1966. Re alnico vs. ceramic & 250k pots I can't really tell ya but I'd think the larger values would make for a brighter sound but I may be mistaken.

Cheers,
KF

[JD0x0]

Pots: Higher value = greater resonant peak on '10' (gives perceived brighter tone)
Lower value pot bleeds more signal to ground when on '10' giving a more narrow range of tones, with a 'warmer' sound with the pot on '10'
A higher value pot can be rolled back to emulate lower value pots.
I know people generally think the rule = 250K for singles, but I use 500k/1Meg/'No load' controls on most of my guitars, including my single coil guitars, S500, Legacy, and Tele.


The C3 cap shifts the resonant peak to a lower frequency, like using a REALLY long cable.

[Fumble fingers]

the knowledge base has the neck info for all the years ..... the numbering system has changed over the years ..... look up the year of your guitar ( based on your serial number or take neck off ) and find the neck specs of that year ..... it's obvious it's a #3 rosewood neck of the year it was made , could be 1 3/4 nut

[Craig]

the knowledge base has the neck info for all the years ..... the numbering system has changed over the years ..... look up the year of your guitar ( based on your serial number or take neck off ) and find the neck specs of that year ..... it's obvious it's a #3 rosewood neck of the year it was made , could be 1 3/4 nut

Here's the link to the post FF mentioned: What are the USA neck size options, past and present?.

Leo-era #4 necks are 1 3/4" with 12" fret board radius… I have 2 axes with them and I dig the extra real estate.

KF, If your two really have #4 necks, then they should have a 25" fretboard radius. If they do have a 12" radius, then they are #3 necks. Check the link above and
see this page from the July 1, 1990 G&L Price List which shows the available neck options:

[Fumble fingers]

my 86 Rampage is 1 3/4 25 and very thin , wonder what the thickness difference is between them all ??

[Katefan]

Craig, good to see the actual reference sheet. I got my info from GGJaguar's site where I believe he states a #3 neck is 1 3/4 with a 25".

FF - I think most tend to be on the thin side tho I guess its all relative. My Invader's pretty chunky. My ASAT Bluesboy style prototype is still on the chunky side but a bit thinner than the Invader. I recall my Rampage and Superhawk being about the same tho the latter was probably the thinnest I owed. I know there are early ASAT's with these neck as well. Would be nice to hear any owner chime in with a report. I find the larger necks pretty darn comfortable.

Cheers,
KF

[jackstraw]

Thanks all. I didn't see a specific post explaining how to date CLF SNs, just pre-1992 guitars. This one has a 4 bolt G&L stamped neck plate, so I guess it's 1998-2008 #3 (1 3/4 inch nut width, 2 1/4 inch width at body joint, 12-inch radius). Interestingly, it's not so thick up high, ~0.91" at the 12th fret. But, a very comfortable neck, very similar to my acoustic guitar.

As for the pots, I understand that the 250K tone pot will have less treble than the stock 500K. I'm curious about the 250K bass pot instead of the 1M. Does this mean the bass is throttled way back on this guitar? The guitar sounds pretty darn good as it is, but cutting way back on the bass seems like a weird choice for the vintage Fender-y pickups in this guitar. Any input would be appreciated, thanks guys.

Oh yeah, here is the great post that I mentioned that compared Legacy and S-500 wiring. Very helpful so I thought I should reference it here.

http://www.guitarsbyleo.com/FORUM/viewt ... 15&t=11704

[Craig]

I didn't see a specific post explaining how to date CLF SNs, just pre-1992 guitars.

See these posts which are in the G&L Knowledgebase:
How do I determine an instrument's age?
Serial number significance

Hope this helps.

Please do post some photos [It does not exist without photos ] and don't forget to add it to our G&L Registry.