About to take a walk on the dark side: 24.75" scale

Swamp ash · Post by **Swamp ash** » Thu May 14, 2015 11:19 am

Getting a Double Cut, P90, LP-esque monster.

So, never really did much time with short-scale guitars - Will I freak out?

Will I ever be the same again

?

lefty_major · Post by **lefty_major** » Fri May 15, 2015 6:26 am

I have a couple of 24.75 scale guitars. One, a double cut P90 hollow body. I love the sound, weight, look and feel of the guitar but the scale is too tight for my large hands. Last month I played it for two weeks straight to force myself to fit into it. It sort of worked but then my band had a gig and I grabbed my ASAT as I headed out the door. I was happy as can be.

I was actually feeling wrist pain toward the end of the two week test. Not when playing but an hour or so after. Is it all psychological?

I just read BB King just passed away. From the pictures I see of him on the internet, I looks like he had large hands but played a 24.75 scale. There are probably many others that do the same. And there are many that bounce back and forth between the two scales, some on this forum. I always wonder, why not just play and stick with 25.5?

All the same, I’d say, just try it out. Play both and your hands/body will let you know.

Swamp ash · Post by **Swamp ash** » Fri May 15, 2015 7:15 am

Well, I love my bolt-ons, but the call of this set neck was too much. Should be getting it next week.
The other times I tried a 24.75, it just made me a bit sloppier in the high registers, but power chords were easy! At least it won't be as tiny as a mandolin!

WitSok · Post by **WitSok** » Fri May 15, 2015 11:57 am

I have both 25.5 inch and 24.75 inch scale guitars. I don't consider myself to have big hands. Overall, I prefer 25.5 inch scale. The upper register just feels too cramped on my 24.75 scale. Though bar and power chords are easier in the lower register. I find that I am more sensitive to the issue while playing in sitting position - though this probably more to do with waist location. While standing it doesn't seem as bad. I keep thinking a jaguar or mustang would be fun, but I am reluctant given the 24 inch scale length. Funny thing the only one I tried did seem cramped...

WitSok · Post by **WitSok** » Fri May 15, 2015 12:05 pm

I should note I try to keep my guitars in a regular rotation to keep them about equally played. I don't worry about having specific tone for a song were playing, rather I try to use the tone of the day to the best of my ability to add texture and depth - if that make sense. Oh and I'm not very accomplished either.

candleman · Post by **candleman** » Fri May 15, 2015 9:19 pm

Scale length doesn't bug me anywhere near as much as neck profile size. I need a baseball bat under my fretting hand, LOL. I ordered my newest G&L with a #3 C neck withan 1-11/16" nut... wow am I glad I did. I'm not sure why this is the ONLY 1-11/16" nut G&L offers... but it will be the only neck I every get on all future G&Ls.

Didn't I read somewhere that 1-11/16" nut is the world standard for Fender-esque guitars (or something like that?)...

Puny necks actually cause me hand muscle pain.

I once had a Fender made in Japan '62 Re-issue Strat that... well I used to tell people "its like having a pencil in your hand with 6 strings strung to it." The neck was so dinky that one actually hurt to play. The strings were way to close together for anything called blues to be played... so I sold it to a guy with itty bitty hands, and he loved it. It was a gorgeous guitar, I honestly think the Japanese make better Fenders than Fender makes Fenders. Of course tey have been copy-catting them for decades, LOL... they finally got it right I guess... My fave Strat is a made in Japan 1990-something Fotoflame '57 re-issue. Its been my gigging "Strat" for a long time. It has this fat-daddy baseball bat soft-V neck I love. It is my favorite neck of all guitars... until I ordered my G&L with the #3 C 1-11/16" nut Legcay HB, hard tail, reverse headstock MONSTER... now rising up as one of the most awesome guitars I've ever owned.

Now scale length... Fender Mustangs come to mind... not into them, and they have some type of itty bitty scale length. That's a 24" scale length and poo-poo to me.

I had a 1972 Gibson SG II (two black plastic covered mini-humbuckers) which had a smaller scale length than normal SGs... I think it might have had a 24" scale. AND the necks were pencils, too on that model. Then they through in a dinky nut width, too on that model... another guitar that hurts my hands to play... I thinks its more about nut width for me, not scale length between 25-1/2" and 24-3/4"...

candleman · Post by **candleman** » Fri May 15, 2015 9:27 pm

ps. Some of the Rickenbacher guitars have a smaller nut width and they are poo-poo to play, too. (to me) Then they make Ricks with a wider nut width and they are beasts... The 360 vs the 370 Ricks... 360s have 1-11/16" nuts...ahhhhh... the 370s have 1-5/8" nut... pooooo-poooo...

GeorgeB · Post by **GeorgeB** » Sat May 16, 2015 7:50 am

WitSok wrote:I should note I try to keep my guitars in a regular rotation to keep them about equally played. I don't worry about having specific tone for a song were playing, rather I try to use the tone of the day to the best of my ability to add texture and depth - if that make sense. Oh and I'm not very accomplished either.

Well said, 1+. I also switch between my amps regularly, helps to keep a fresh attitude in my playing and keeps you fit for those moments when you have to use a colleage's gear for whatever reason.

I'm glad to own a few shorter scale guitars and a prefer the ones with wider/fatter necks. The shortest scale belongs to the PRS SE Bernie Marsden with 24.5" (622m), which I really enjoy, the 'fat wide' neck is excellent -- chunky and soild but not too bulky for my medium-sized hands. The neck of my Epi Lucille (RIP, B.B.King) is slightly over the top for my tastes.

In my dreams I sometimes imagine a 24.75" or 25" scale on a mahogany ASAT Special with the fat #4 (1.5") neck... that for sure would be gorgeous, wouldn't it?

y2kc · Post by **y2kc** » Sat May 16, 2015 9:53 am

Yes you will freak out and never be the same. Some survive this crazyness and the rest end up living in a van down by the river.

Actually I imagine you will be fine. What are you getting?

I switch back and forth on a regular basis and was just playing my Heritage H-125. Just turn that amp up and those pickups should scream.

Come on what are you getting?

y2kc

glvourot · Post by **glvourot** » Sat May 16, 2015 5:15 pm

I bought an SG back in February. No problems going back and forth. Its nice to have a humbucker option.

geoff douglas · Post by **geoff douglas** » Sun May 17, 2015 6:59 am

No fans of the Ascari here?, better feel and tone than any SG for less money, is that too big a statement?.
G

helle-man · Post by **helle-man** » Sun May 17, 2015 7:20 am

Personally, I think it's a good idea to have different guitars around with different feels. They force you to play outside the box, or your comfort zone.

I don't like to be stuck on one kind of neck profile or scale. There are too many cool guitars out there, especially old ones that you can't (or shouldn't) change.

I find it easier to just adjust to a guitar's nature, rather than change the nature of a guitar just to suit me. Maybe I'm weird.

Will

glvourot · Post by **glvourot** » Sun May 17, 2015 9:13 am

I could not have said it better myself Helle-Man. And yes, there are too many cool guitars in the world.

lefty_major · Post by **lefty_major** » Sun May 17, 2015 12:12 pm

I agree with switching things up. My comfort zone is a G&L #3 neck. When I play my few other electrics for a few days or a few weeks as I mentioned above, I think my playing has some how improved when I return to the #3. Could be my imagination or just a different way of adjusting back in. I think it's all in my head.

I have another 24.75" scale that I consider a thin profile neck. Love the guitar, not the neck. I don't consider myself a tight gripper, but I wonder if my grip is too tight and I don't know it. There a plenty of players that dig thinner necks but I can't figure out why I can't at least enjoy one on occasion.

Swamp ash · Post by **Swamp ash** » Mon May 18, 2015 3:44 pm

y2kc wrote:Yes you will freak out and never be the same. Some survive this crazyness and the rest end up living in a van down by the river.

Actually I imagine you will be fine. What are you getting?

I switch back and forth on a regular basis and was just playing my Heritage H-125. Just turn that amp up and those pickups should scream.

Come on what are you getting?

y2kc

Well, it's a small company copy of a Les Paul special double cutaway, ash and rosewood, with two P90s and a compensated wrap-around bridge. Very traditional set up.

I am excited, and I will freak out and never come back. It may be a "gateway" guitar...

KenC · Post by **KenC** » Mon May 18, 2015 7:18 pm

Coming from the bass side of the house, I am a huge fan of short scales. I have large hands, and have been playing 34" scale electric basses for about 35 years. I'm also very comfortable playing a 3/4 scale upright (the standard size) with a 42" scale. That said, I absolutely love the feel of a 30" scale EB-0 or Music Master. My son has an early 2000s Fender "P-Bass Junior" that is about 28", and is even more fun to play.

The vast majority of my guitars are 25.5" scale G&Ls, and I find them to be very comfortable. The 24.75" scale on my G-200 makes it very enjoyable to play. I wouldn't have any trouble swapping back and forth between the G-200 and any of my other G&Ls. One of my sons has a 22" scale Duo Sonic reissue, which I do find too short to be useful. It's easy enough to play, but the tone and intonation are terrible.

I did just get the chance yesterday to experience a 23" scale Gretsch Rambler archtop, and fell in love. The intonation was fine, and the tone was incredible. As a bonus, playing a Mickey Baker style G major 7 chord that stretches from the third fret to the seventh fret was a piece of cake (not that I have a problem with that on a full-scale G&L).

I'm sure you'll enjoy the LP Special. It won't ruin you for G&Ls...

Ken

john o · Post by **john o** » Mon May 18, 2015 7:35 pm

i like variety as well. my LP, SG and epi 335 all have 24.75 scale. bends are a little easier with less string tension at standard tuning with the shorter scale. frets are a little closer together in the upper register, but that works. i like the different size necks, feel, tone, looks, vibe, mojo of these gtrs, which inspire me to go different places, musically. i usually take 2 gtrs to a gig. used to be 'singles' and 'doubles'. now it's a g&L and something else. problem is, now i tend to play through the whole set on the asat, it's so versatile. i guess that's not really a problem!

CSVeteran · Post by **CSVeteran** » Sun May 24, 2015 9:14 am

The only advantage of a 24.7 scale I can see is if someone had arthritis in their fingers, it would be easier to bend strings. The downside is it's harder to play fingerstyle, given the tighter space.

Case24 · Post by **Case24** » Sun May 31, 2015 6:41 pm

I have a Gibson LP and enjoy playing it as much as my ASAT Classic. I have no trouble switching back and forth with scale lengths. I think it's good to switch things up now and then.

lefty_major · Post by **lefty_major** » Mon Jun 01, 2015 1:48 pm

10 days on a 24.75 scale. Nothing else. Gigged with it Friday and it was as comfortable as can be. I still prefer my ASAT but I needed to try this out.

Retired_Colonel · Post by **Retired_Colonel** » Wed Jul 15, 2015 9:18 pm

Love my G200... really don't notice the difference that much.

deytookerjaabs · Post by **deytookerjaabs** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 3:33 pm

Mess with strings! I always thought a little something was missing with my Gibby style solid bodies until I got pure nickel strings, for some reason my ears still prefer the Gibson Vintage Reissues. But, there are some other real solid pure nickels out there too.

Also, Tune your tune-o-matic, that's what it's for! By this, I mean, adjust the stop bar to different heights to change the break angle and see what feels/sounds the best for you. Some people prefer a real shallow angle, some have the thing all the way down, I usually try to mirror the headstock angle. I've wowed a few of my buddies just by throwing on those vintage reissue nickels and getting a nice break angle from the stop bar on their guitar. When you go from a lower tension string with a soft break angle to the higher tension with a steeper angle I think it wakes those guitars right up, after you adjust the truss rod back into place of course.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:52 pm

geoff douglas wrote:No fans of the Ascari here?, better feel and tone than any SG for less money, is that too big a statement?.
G

My son plays one through a '78 Fender Champ and LOVES it.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Thu Jul 16, 2015 7:53 pm

helle-man wrote: I find it easier to just adjust to a guitar's nature, rather than change the nature of a guitar just to suit me. Maybe I'm weird.

Will

Yes you are weird. And you are also right. More guitars, less war, right?

Swamp ash · Post by **Swamp ash** » Thu Aug 20, 2015 8:53 am

Well, several months in and I love the little "special".

While it doesn't have the snap of a 25.5" scale, it is a fantastic player. The P90s are a bit different, too, but they cook up some great rock.

For anyone interested, the wraparound compensated bridge (mojoaxe) is the schitz - it is always in tune and intonated.

But, good news, I found a great place for this little axe - it just loves to hang out in open G, which is something I could not do with my tremolo G&L!

JimmyJames · Post by **JimmyJames** » Wed Oct 14, 2015 4:11 pm

CSVeteran wrote:The only advantage of a 24.7 scale I can see is if someone had arthritis in their fingers, it would be easier to bend strings. The downside is it's harder to play fingerstyle, given the tighter space.

This is true. I have arthritis very bad. And for my gae it is very advanced. I have had guillain barre syndrome twice in my life. Paralyzed me from head to toe. it also fry's your nerves and causes premature arthritis.

The short scale of the Gibson makes it much easier for me to bend. I also feel I can play for longer before my hands start to hurt. I use 8 and a half guage strings on it. I use to use 8's until the 8.5 came out. I started using the 8.5 on my G&L's as well.

The i really like the darker tone and feel of the short scale. They also just sound like 70's Rock. And that is my thing.

In the studio I use G&L for 70% of the guitar tracks. Gibson for the rest. But having different feeling guitars make me play different. In a good way. Also when I am writing songs, the guitar can play a influence on the song. Well to be honest it flat out plays a influence in my writing.
We have a song called "Backslider" and a video for it. I wrote the song on my "Bluesboy". That song would have never came about on my Les Paul. We have a song called "Sober Up", I wrote it on my G&L Legacy. That song would not have happened if I was using something else. The guitar I am playing helps me write the song. Vibe and feel, all that good stuff.

lefty_major · Post by **lefty_major** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:50 am

I dig your post JimmyJames.

Fumble fingers · Post by **Fumble fingers** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:58 am

lefty_major wrote:I dig your post JimmyJames.

X2

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:42 am

well, I received this on saturday and haven't really put it down yet.

Neck is 1 3/4" but not too thick, I love it, plays like budda.

Where I am right now, I have my G&L LE-2 and this.

ITS all I need, happy guy! Going between the two is fun!

When I opened the case,

I am totally not worth of such a fine instrument, but happy to have it!

SouthpawGuy · Post by **SouthpawGuy** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:50 am

Excellent

john o · Post by **john o** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 7:08 pm

wow! radical, Alf! more details, please...

Elwood · Post by **Elwood** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:42 pm

drjho7 wrote:wow! radical, Alf! more details, please...

+1
I like how the pickguard screw is one of the o's in Coyote...Genius!!

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:53 am

Thanks.

2015 Teye Super Coyote, LH, Orange. Here's the details of the guitar.
http://www.teye.com/coyote/

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:50 am

I apologize, just realized my Teye is a 25.5 inch scale. That surprised me. Its a 24 fret, so that's probably why and why it plays so nice, lol. Interesting.

SouthpawGuy · Post by **SouthpawGuy** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:43 am

astutzmann wrote:I apologize, just realized my Teye is a 25.5 inch scale. That surprised me. Its a 24 fret, so that's probably why and why it plays so nice, lol. Interesting.

You can send it to me if you don't like the 25.5 scale

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 4:53 am

nice try, its not going anywhere

SouthpawGuy · Post by **SouthpawGuy** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 5:59 am

Had to give it a try

darwinohm · Post by **darwinohm** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:57 am

Yep, thats a keeper!!!!!!!!!! -- Darwin

JimmyJames · Post by **JimmyJames** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:12 pm

Wow that is very cool man! Congrats. It is like a Brian May, a Les Paul, and a Ouija board had a baby and Jerry Garcia directed the guitar orgy. The case looks real nice to man. I am so happy for you to own such a unique bad ass guitar.
You enjoy that that thing man. Take her on long walks. Be sure to tell her often how pretty she is. I see a long relationship between you two.

JimmyJames · Post by **JimmyJames** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:14 pm

I forgot to ask. What kind of pick ups are those? And what are the saddles made of? Is it a bone nut? 12" radius neck? Let me in on all the hot gossip.

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Sat Oct 17, 2015 2:56 am

they are custom wound lollars, wound to Teye's specs. They are very nice. Not really overwound for growl, but not vintage either. Bone nut and interesting, the nut slots for strings 3 and 4 are angled towards the tuners, unique to me.

Saddles are steel, look like the steel in my dfv bridge on my LE-2. could be the same type?

Radius is 12.

The case is very interesting, its like a gun case, hard plastic with locking capabilities, its like a heavy duty case you would use for air travel.

Thanks for all the kind words, I am still discovering things about her everyday. The body is 1 1/2" thick so not heavy. My heritage 150 was 2 inches thick and 9 pounds 8 ounces. It had Wolfetone Marshallheads in it and they were hot and growled. They replaced SD 59s which I found too quiet as they are vintage pups.

john o · Post by **john o** » Sat Oct 17, 2015 3:41 am

controls are vol/vol/tone and "mojo" - how's that one?

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Sat Oct 17, 2015 4:05 am

Here's the details on the MOJO

http://www.teye.com/sounds/
http://www.teye.com/circuitry/

sam · Post by **sam** » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:16 am

Hey Alf sweet score.

I've read about Teye's many times but never had my hands on one, that is a real looker.

Post some clips if you can, would love to hear that beauty.

JimmyJames · Post by **JimmyJames** » Sat Oct 17, 2015 12:08 pm

Lollar makes great pick ups. I have a set that I install in my Legacy for recording. He really does pickups right. I am so happy for you to own such a unique custom guitar. All of us, everyone on this forum. We all deserve nice guitars that make us happy.
We are lucky to be guitar players and musicians. Not everyone can do it. It also means we are living our dreams of playing guitar. Think about how many people's dreams die after high school or college. For us, we get to live our dream our entire life.
Congrats again on that guitar. I am so happy for you.

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Sun Oct 18, 2015 4:00 am

thanks very much, its magical.

I'm sorry I stole this thread.

As far as I'm concerned, I have played guitars of various scales and I have no issue going between them. But I am not a gigging musician, either.

SouthpawGuy · Post by **SouthpawGuy** » Sun Oct 18, 2015 4:15 am

@ Alf ... so you sold the H-150 ?

astutzmann · Post by **astutzmann** » Sun Oct 18, 2015 8:02 am

yup, amazing eh....this Teye replaces it.

Loved the 150, its an awesome guitar and the new owner is soo happy. But never played it, almost always play my 535 instead.

Never thought I'd sell that one, but hey.

SouthpawGuy · Post by **SouthpawGuy** » Sun Oct 18, 2015 11:49 am

Some lefty "short scale" solid body goodness ...

Heritage 150, 157, 137 ( still made one at a time in Kalamazoo )

Heritage 170

Ibanez AR300L Artist MIJ 1981

Yamaha SBG2000 MIJ 1982

Hamer USA Studio Mahogany

Hamer USA Studio Custom

Gibson Les Paul Std 1990

.

Elwood · Post by **Elwood** » Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:39 pm

SouthpawGuy wrote:Some lefty "short scale" solid body goodness ...

...Heavens to murgitroid!!!