First Post

[myatuck]

I've been wanting to add a G&L to the stable.

First attempt went south when an online dealer sold me a floor demo (or quite possibly "B" stock) with issues after advertising it as "brand new". Rock Island Sound. He took it back but made me eat return shipping. Not pleased.

Second attempt went south 30 minutes ago when I met a guy from Craigslist to pick up a "perfect" Tribute Legacy, natural finish, stunning guitar. With two holes drilled into the back above the access plate! And not very well, my 10 yr old grandson could have done a neater job using a 1/2" hammer drill.

No big deal, I imagine I'll eventually acquire something G&L, just odd that out of dozens of guitar transactions and literally tens of thousands transactions overall, G&L burps first two times up.

1st Query: Why would someone drill two holes above the inspection plate? Small holes, the same size as I'm guessing the plate screws require. Guitar was supposedly stock except for replacement of the bridge pickup. Bridge looked to be okay and in stock location but the holes indicated otherwise, that the inspection plate had been relocated downwards or wasn't the correct plate to begin with. Just trying to understand what the previous owner might have been up to so as to avoid the same problem going forward.

2nd Query: I noticed, when I was still considering a new G&L, that the factory has no customer service. No email. No 800 number. I even tried emailing some corporate honchos and all those emails came back undeliverable. How can they get away with that? I mean, I know it's legal but when I can call or email Fender or better yet Schecter (absolute great customer service) and have someone respond almost immediately, how is it you G&L lovers defend the absence of a factory care operation? For example, when Rock Island Sound screwed me over, I had no where to turn but Reverb, which by the way, were very good about the entire episode.


Thanks.

[Yamwich]

If I'm reading you correctly, you aren't a customer and you've had an issue with a dealer and a Tribute series owner, and you think this gives you the right to blast G&L corporate via e-mail and rant on an online message board.

I don't get it. It's widely known that you need to work with a dealer, preferably one local to you, for a new G&L. Maybe I'm getting it wrong, but I kinda don't think so.

[myatuck]

1. I had a problem with an authorized G&L dealer. Hell yes, I believe that gives me the right to email G&L headquarters and let them know who they have selling their product. What does 'authorized' mean if it doesn't mean oversight and when necessary corrective action?

2. I asked a question as to why a G&L owner might drill holes in the back of his or her guitar. For example, do the inspection plates tend to break and people install something the wrong size because they can't buy a correct replacement? For example, is there a popular mod that requires a different, non-conforming inspection plate? For example, was there a factory run of improperly drilled Tributes, hence the guy was selling a "b" stock after telling me it was perfect?

Questions are not rants.
Attempting to notify the factory of a bad dealer is not a blast.

If your's is the prevalent attitude on this forum, my first post will be my last.

Wow! This G&L experience just gets better and better.

[myatuck]

Have other stuff I should be doing but I'm trying to determine why that guitar was drilled.

Looking at Google and Reverb images, I see a lot of white inspection plates on these things, very few black ones. Yet, the one I had in my hands today had a black plate. Six screws.

It also had a 4 bolt chrome neck plate.

These two tidbits help?

I didn't notice a serial number decal. I've asked the owner if it is there and I just overlooked it. I have no idea if he will reply.

Thanks

[Fumble fingers]

I have no idea why someone would drill a couple holes in back ??.... maybe thought about installing some EMG's then decided it was more work than they wanted to do ??... who knows ??.. it's not common

I would order a new one through a good dealer , I have bought new G&L's from three different dealers and have had excellent results from all three

[myatuck]

I have no idea why someone would drill a couple holes in back ??.... maybe thought about installing some EMG's then decided it was more work than they wanted to do ??... who knows ??.. it's not common

I would order a new one through a good dealer , I have bought new G&L's from three different dealers and have had excellent results from all three

Thank you. A botched battery install. Or, an external battery install since removed. That would explain it. Dayton. Grew up not too far from there. Loved visiting the Wright Pat museum. That Valkyrie still sitting out there on the tarmac? What a beast.

[KenC]

Welcome to the forum. If you haven't noticed, things tend to be dead around here on weekends.

I've never bought a new G&L or owned a Tribute, so I don't have much to offer on either of your questions. It's not unusual to see posts about problems with on-line dealers. The positive posts tend to be about brick-and-mortar stores, even when a purchase is done entirely by phone or email. I'm sure a lot of folks on this forum could give you recommendations on dealers they've had good experiences with. You could probably find a lot of discussion about dealer experiences (good and bad) by browsing through old threads.

I have no idea about the extra holes. I'm not sure whether you are referring to the plate over the control cavity, or the one over the vibrato cavity. Screwing anything back there doesn't make sense. It's impossible to relocate the bridge on a G&L without some major woodworking, so scars from that would have been very obvious. Every one of my G&Ls with rear-mounted controls has the back cover inset into the body, so shifting it any way wouldn't be possible without routing. You suggested it could have been for an extra battery, but Legacies are passive. Unless the seller had added a pre-amp, and needed somewhere to stick the battery...

It is very difficult to get in touch with G&L. I went to great lengths to find out about some replacement parts a couple of years ago. It took a while to get through, but the support was excellent once I did. A couple of things to keep in mind are:

1. G&L doesn't have a full-time customer service rep. The person who handles inquiries works full-time in the factory. Even with the increasing popularity of G&Ls, it is still a very small operation.

2. G&L sells through dealers, and as Yamwich and Fumble Fingers mentioned, and generally customer service is handled through them. Of course, that's not helpful when your problem is with the dealer.

I hope this is somewhat helpful.

Ken

[Craig]

You must not have gone to the main G&L website, glguitars.com or missed the Support link in the main menu.

BTW, G&L does not sell seconds or "B" stock instruments. In the past I have noticed that some dealers do advertise "B-stock" items which are
likely demo instruments. I have brought this to Dave McLaren's (President of G&L) attention in the past.

Hope this helps.

[myatuck]

"You must not have gone to the main G&L website, glguitars.com or missed the Support link in the main menu."

I did in fact go to that page. I emailed every address there and as noted in my first post, all were returned as undeliverable, postmaster. And before someone posts that their computers must have been down, my emails were spaced over the course of a week, one at a time.



"It's not unusual to see posts about problems with on-line dealers. The positive posts tend to be about brick-and-mortar stores, even when a purchase is done entirely by phone or email."

Rock Island Sound is a brick and mortar with three stores in the Tarrytown, NY area. The transaction was, as you surmised, internet based. I could have bought the identical guitar from SamAsh, I talked to them at the same time, on the same day. They had it in stock, ready to go. However, I like to, when the price is competitive, reward the smaller operations. E.g, I just added an AC15c1 to the mix, came from some small operation in Pennsylvania. Beautiful transaction. Same price as the big internet operation. No reason to go small except to reward a smaller operation. This means that while I often deal with the big internet outlets because of price or inventory, I have also dealt with dozens of smaller entities around the country. This time it went south, as I said, no big deal, crap happens. That said, and even though you were careful to preface your comment with "not unusual" and "tend to be", I think your comparison of brick and mortar to internet is a generalization which may reflect your experience but certainly does not match mine, I double dollar guarantee you that SamAsh (as well as MF, Sweetwater, etc.) would have been all over making the G&L purchase 'right'.


"G&L doesn't have a full-time customer service rep. The person who handles inquiries works full-time in the factory. Even with the increasing popularity of G&Ls, it is still a very small operation."

If I were running any size business (and I have), the very first person I would hire would be a customer rep. If I can't easily tell G&L they have a dealer problem, who is? "Hello, factory, this is Dealer BX3211. I just tried to screw some guy on the internet, does that get me 6 points off my next 12 purchases?" Translated: If you only hear from the dealers, you only serve the dealers. If I can tell my story and the only defense people hear is that G&L is "small", how is that G&L hopes to get big? A single customer care rep costs less than a hundred grand a year, salary benefits desk chair computer, maybe a little less if he or she works from home. That's a 100-150 email responses a day, a vigilant window into forums like these, a customer care troubleshooter ready to get on a plane at a moment's instance, and a complete set of management reports. All for $100k a year. What is that, $1.15 a guitar? As I stated, I can reach the other factories at will, there's a reason why they are more successful, Schecter and Fender in particular could not be more responsive. [edit: I could look it up but how does G&L compare to Moog, size wise? I just had a problem with a Minifooger. Emailed the factory. Immediate, comprehensive response. Short version: We'll fix it, replace it, whatever it takes to make it right. If you need it, we'll ship you a replacement overnight and work out the details later. Could not have been more pleasant or professional. MF SDOTD Minifooger @$90, G&L Tribute ASAT Classic @$450. You do the math.]

This is not a rant. A rant is someone expressing anger, frustration. I'm not angry, I could care less. Eating $29.84 of return shipping is nothing, in fact, Reverb offered to cover it if I would remove Rock Island's negative review. I declined. And, I need another guitar like I need another hole in my head. I asked the question how is it you G&L fans can justify the lack of customer support to see if I was in fact missing something. Apparently, I'm not. There is no customer support. That's good to know, not only for me but others contemplating a G&L purchase, especially those who don't have access to a trusted brick and mortar G&L dealer that has absolutely no chance of changing hands or going bankrupt in the next, say, 20 years.

I post. Polite, truthful, professional. Those of you so inclined, respond. Polite, truthful, professional. I respond to your responses. You respond to my responses to your response. That's how this works. A digital conversation that continues until the issue is fully fleshed, recorded for posterity in hopes it helps others. Same as the old days when everyone lived in little towns and knew everyone's business except the geography is bigger and the record more permanent. Good businesses prospering, not so good falling by the wayside.

Thanks

Edit 4/27 8:30 AM: Just pulled the trigger on MF's STDOTD, Tribute ASAT Deluxe Carved Top. So, for better or worse, like it or not, I'm now one of you

[Craig]

See this post here, as it might explain why you did not hear from anyone at G&L/BBESound.

Hope this helps.



PS Let us know how you like the Tribute ASAT Deluxe Carved Top and don't forget to post photos and add it to our G&L Registry.
Also, where are you located?

[myatuck]

Thank you for the courtesy of your post. The extended IT issues you describe cover the time period of my emails and would explain the bounce backs.

As for the ASAT Deluxe, I, late yesterday evening, had a change of heart and cancelled the order, opting instead for another Schecter. Should be here by week's end. That makes 2 of those (PT Fastback, T S/H1 Classic) one Fender (Deluxe Roadhouse), one Epiphone (LP Florentine).

You guys and gals take care, I wish you the best.