Need recommendation for beefier strat!

[tce44]

Hi,
New to the board and interested in a G& L strat guitar,
need one thats fuller/beefier humbucker sounding with single coil size pickups,
any recommendations on one?
Kinda had these in mind:
LEGACY
LEGACY SPECIAL
S-500
Cant try out though cause no one has them in my area.
Thanx for help.

[Fumble fingers]

Welcome to the board !! .... Comanche with Will Ray bridge pick up would be my choice for single coil strat

[Craig]

Hi,
New to the board and interested in a G& L strat guitar,
need one thats fuller/beefier humbucker sounding with single coil size pickups,
any recommendations on one?
Kinda had these in mind:
LEGACY
LEGACY SPECIAL
S-500
Cant try out though cause no one has them in my area.
Thanx for help.

Perhaps these posts might help:

So, what's the best guitar FOR YOU? by Boogie Bill.

S500, Comanche, Legacy Special questions.

[jeffmarshall67]

you sir need a comanche

[SamIV]

I am in the same boat you are in, no local dealers in my immediate area. Lucky there are reputable dealers that will let you return a guitar these days it you don't like it. One on ebay advertises they will pay the return shipping if you don't like the guitar. I am getting ready to order a Fallout to see if I like it. Good luck

[Craig]

I am in the same boat you are in, no local dealers in my immediate area. Lucky there are reputable dealers that will let you return a guitar these days it you don't like it. One on ebay advertises they will pay the return shipping if you don't like the guitar. I am getting ready to order a Fallout to see if I like it. Good luck

I just added this to the General G&L Questions sub-forum of the G&L Knowledgebase: Where can I hear and see samples of G&L instruments?.

Hope this helps.

[tce44]

Thanx everyone for the help,Im still contemplating but all this info will make it an easier decision.
Musicians Friend has alot and good with returns but Ill serach some more to find a couple to try.
Im really digging the Legacy Special with twin blade pickups,sonic blue is killer color!

[Salmon]

G&L's are eligible for the sales at MF as well.

I am curious, is it the body shape that draws you to a Strat? Going with full size HB's will eliminate the quack. If the Strat sound is part of the equation go with the single coil size HB's, perhaps the blade types. If you want the SC Strat tone with beef and variations my vote is for the S-500. With the G&L PTB system and the MFD pickups it is an incredibly non-whimpy Strat style guitar.

My personal opinion, the Z-coils need to be experienced as you cannot rely on words or even sound clips alone. If you can't try them in a store buying online with a good safe return window is great even if you lose a little money shipping it back.

[CGT]

I'll play Devil's advocate here as I don't believe that beefy sound necessarily requires a humbucker-equipped guitar. You need to define beefy. If you're looking for saturated creamy overdriven tone characteristic of a Gibson Les Paul then that iconic set-neck is the way to go. However, if you're looking for a richer, darker take on the Stratocaster sound go with the standard Legacy. The PTB tone control gives you much more shaping over frequency spectrum than do traditional tone controls and, unlike on standard Strats, it also affects the bridge pickup. You can go from dark Stevie Ray Vaughn to sparkling Knopfler sounds with one guitar. Pair it with the right amp and you've got yourself one heckuva beefy setup.

[blargfromouterspace]

I'll play Devil's advocate here as I don't believe that beefy sound necessarily requires a humbucker-equipped guitar

+1. The biggest part of a strat sound is single coils. I'd get a standard Legacy and put Bill Lawrence L298 pickups in it. Fat, beefy single coil sounds. If you want the far beefier sound of humbuckers, get full sized ones, as on the Legacy 2HB. The single-coil sized 'buckers are a compromise and, IMO, crapola.

[fianoman]

If you are not transfixed on the strat shape, listen to some of the clips of sc-2's or asat special with those jumbo MFD's. Stratolicious and beefy.

[Lazer]

I'll play Devil's advocate here as I don't believe that beefy sound necessarily requires a humbucker-equipped guitar. You need to define beefy. If you're looking for saturated creamy overdriven tone characteristic of a Gibson Les Paul then that iconic set-neck is the way to go. However, if you're looking for a richer, darker take on the Stratocaster sound go with the standard Legacy. The PTB tone control gives you much more shaping over frequency spectrum than do traditional tone controls and, unlike on standard Strats, it also affects the bridge pickup. You can go from dark Stevie Ray Vaughn to sparkling Knopfler sounds with one guitar. Pair it with the right amp and you've got yourself one heckuva beefy setup.

Well, yes and no. The reason a humbucker is "beefier" then a single coil is that it has a bigger magnetic field which means it
reads "more string vibration". A tone curquit can only remove, never add. That is why most single coils are "thinner" sounding
than most humbuckers. The S-500 mfd's are quite nice but not humbucker "beefy".

Cheers
L-zr

[Fumble fingers]

I have a S500 , Legacy , SC 2 , ASAT deluxe twin humbucker and a Comanche with Will Ray bridge pick up ..... to my ears the Comanche is the only that comes close to humbucker deepness and still sounds like a single coil

[NickHorne]

I do agree with Fingers about the Z-coils, and especially that Will Ray back pickup! It's like that bright-but-fat Tele back pup you always wanted in a Strat, but punchier and hum-cancelling. Shame it doesn't come stock on the Comanche, although I also know what G&L mean with the regular Comanche back pickup (wound the same as the other two, like old Strats were), it's akin to that bright skanky old Strat back-pup sound that some love and others can't wait to change...
I have the Z-coils in a Will Ray signature Asat (with WR's extra-wound back pup which comes with the model), and it's my head-and-shoulders go-to, and not just for the B-bender.
Z-coils are a surprise. With your volume & tone controls dimed, like you might with a regular Fender, and your amp dialled like for the same regular Fender, the Zs are emphatically in-your-face. Once you get into redialling both guitar and amp, you will find something very versatile, very satisfying and hum-free. But until then, on first acquaintance, you could be confused.
If you could find a Tribute Will Ray to try, that could give you a fair insight into the pups.

And Lazer, I agree but I only partly agree; humbuckers "see more string", and so generate more output, but only if the two bits of string above each coil are moving in the same direction. If they're not, then their signals cancel out in the humbucker's output. Smaller movements in the string are the higher harmonics of its vibration, that give it its brightness, or twang. The longer the vibrating length of string, the higher the harmonics are that the humbucker ignores; it stays fairly twangy down by the nut, and becomes progressively more fundamental-dominant the further up we fret a string. These are characteristics that some love, others not. But the difference between this aspect of the humbucker, and the straightforward rendition of what the string is doing (at one point) which the single-coil delivers, is the best way to decide which pickup type will best suit a particular purpose.

Putting Strat-spaced single-coils in series, like a giant-spaced humbucker, is very often good. I like wiring the option of having my bridge 5-way selection to be either the bridge pup, as usual, or alternatively the bridge in series with the middle; that is big and chunky, but never dull. Some of the goodness of the simple, great Danelectros was their series wiring when both pups were selected. Truly single-coil, truly humbucking, bright and fat!

The Legacy / S500 / Comanche you are contemplating have bathtub pup routs (and nothing wrong with that at all, whatever any inflated BS in the hobby press may say). You will have a fabulously well-engineered chassis of a guitar whichever G&L you select, and their production pickguards come from Chandler / Pickguardheaven, who can enable you to play with alternatives to your heart's content.

My 2c is for the Comanche WITH a retrofitted Will Ray back unit, or else the S500. Somewhere around here is a nice vid of Kenny Vaughn (not pulling ahead of the drummer for once) playing some very fat-strat goodness out of an S-500 with Patty Loveless. You may like that as a pointer. If you know a tech who could give you the option of bridge-and-middle-in-series on an S-500, it might be right up your street. And you could "go Comanche" later if you felt inclined.

[Fumble fingers]

I wonder if you could order/specify a WR bridge in a new build Comanche ??..... either way for 69.95 on the On Line Store is pretty darn good too

[NickHorne]

Here's that Vaughn S-500 /Loveless link:

http://guitarsbyleo.com/FORUM/viewtopic ... ess#p45451

Is that Big Strat tone, or were you thinking of something heavier?

[Salmon]

I'll play Devil's advocate here as I don't believe that beefy sound necessarily requires a humbucker-equipped guitar

+1. The biggest part of a strat sound is single coils. I'd get a standard Legacy and put Bill Lawrence L298 pickups in it. Fat, beefy single coil sounds. If you want the far beefier sound of humbuckers, get full sized ones, as on the Legacy 2HB. The single-coil sized 'buckers are a compromise and, IMO, crapola.

As far as I can see the OP, tce44, only mentioned "humbucker" to suggest beefier not to imply only a humbucker is beefy and a single coil is not.

The only thing distinctly Strat about the Strat sound is the "quack." SIngle coils in and of themselves are not responsible for the quack. The Strat sound comes from the placement of narrow pickups. It can be achieved using narrow humbuckers or single coils. Merely using identical single coils without the typical Strat placement on the body will render single-position single coil sounds found in any guitar with single coils (i.e. Tele's and ASAT's) not uniquely Strat sounds. Strat-style guitars come in a wide variety of tonal flavors. There are plenty of tonal options in various pickups and most if not all retain the character that distinguishes a Strat......the quack.......that is when placed in the typical Strat positions on a guitar body.


To the OP, tce44,

No words will do what a guitar in your hands will. Read with an open mind for the information and base your decision on what you like in a guitar as you actually play it.



Now if someone is interested in a sort of dance off competition to see whose is beefier, I'll put my S-500 up against your idea of a beefier Strat.

[CGT]

I learned a lot about pickup physics and placement guys, thanks.