Early 80s F100

[AA eron]

Hey everyone.

This is my first real post here. I have an intro on the introductions thread. I'd like to show, and get some information about, my G&L F100. First, the pics. (this is my first time posting pics on this sight. I hoe it works!)

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-McjRG2lBrWU/U ... F100_4.JPG
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-nbnV3QPhxug/U ... F100_2.JPG
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-4KYuiE8Fxag/U ... 100_10.JPG
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-nL_cJ_ZchWs/U ... F100_9.JPG
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-Vcp30QzC5t8/U ... F100_8.JPG
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-bYQpBzFt5fA/U ... F100_3.JPG
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-7EoP4XLI-9c/U ... F100_7.JPG

[AA eron]

OK, the pics sorta worked, I guess you can click on them. Anyway, there area few things I am curious about.

what is the proper way to set up the trem on this?
the finish appears original (right?) yet there are no holes for the trem cover. did any leave the factory with no trem cover, or even without provision for a trem cover?

Everything on the guitar appears original, the pots date to 80, neck 81, and serial number is G001292. This lack of trem cover thing is really bugging me...

[Fred Finisher]

AA eron,
That's a nice looking F 100. That body is Mahogany and the original color was Sunburst. It appears that we changed the color in the finishing process because the telltale markings of an original factory finish exist. This could have been because the Sunburst did not come out well or because we needed a Gold finish in a hurry so we painted over a Sunburst. The trem cover screw holes could be because someone ordered it without the cover since so many players took them off anyway. The other reason would be that someone took that guitar out the back door in parts. Hopefully, that was not the case but either way, I'm sure with a good set up, it will sound sweet.
Fred

[Miles Smiles]

Welcome! Nice guitar!

Pictures may be displayed inline. If too large with timage and smaller display size specified:

[AA eron]

Thanks for the information Fred. You know, I didn't even notice the "sunburst" in the neck pocket until I looked at the blown up pics here. It's super hard to make out when looking right at it. So what are the telltale markings of a factory finish? I was thinking that there is no other color showing in the chips, and the cavities are finished completely which seems to be rarer when something is refinished, and also the original paint is visible in the cavities under the refin. Anyway, I really do appreciate the info, and the insight on the trem cover.

Miles, thanks for posting the pics. I'll make em smaller next time and see if I can get em to show up right in the thread.

Again, anyone have any tips for setting up the trem? I assume it needs to "float", and be level. The things is, right now it's super sensitive to any pressure applied to it, and I like to rest my hand on the bridge when playing so it is always going in and out of tune. Are there bushings that ware out?

[Craig]

Thanks for the information Fred. You know, I didn't even notice the "sunburst" in the neck pocket until I looked at the blown up pics here. It's super hard to make out when looking right at it. So what are the telltale markings of a factory finish? I was thinking that there is no other color showing in the chips, and the cavities are finished completely which seems to be rarer when something is refinished, and also the original paint is visible in the cavities under the refin. Anyway, I really do appreciate the info, and the insight on the trem cover.

Miles, thanks for posting the pics. I'll make em smaller next time and see if I can get em to show up right in the thread.

Again, anyone have any tips for setting up the trem? I assume it needs to "float", and be level. The things is, right now it's super sensitive to any pressure applied to it, and I like to rest my hand on the bridge when playing so it is always going in and out of tune. Are there bushings that ware out?

Regarding posting photos, see: Tutorial: Posting photos.

See the Album: Instrument Manuals and Wiring Schematics in the Gallery for setup information on your F-100.
Also, check out the G&L Knowledgebase, G&L Tech Tips sub-forum, too.

Hope this helps.

[KenC]

Eron,

That's a beautiful F-100. You don't see many with that finish. I love how that ebony fretboard looks.

Ken

[KenC]

It appears that we changed the color in the finishing process because the telltale markings of an original factory finish exist.

Fred,

I'm very curious about this. Aside from the word "sunburst" stamped in the neck pocket and the brown finish under the white on the back of the neck plate, what telltale markings are there?

I've never seen stamps like the "sunburst" or the one across from it (which I can't make out). Were those only used in certain cases?

Also, would you call this guitar metallic gold or candy lemon? My color vision isn't that great...

Ken

[AA eron]

Craig- thanks for the links, that is even more than I'm looking for. The factory setup specs are awesome. I like to tweak, and theat will be nice to start as if it was never messed with.

Ken- the fretboard is cool. I need to clean and oil it to help bring out the grain a bit more.

Does anyone know if these guitars came from the factory with a rather large spot of glue in the control cavity holding the bridge ground in place?

[KenC]

FWIW, I swear by food grade walnut oil for these old G&L fretboards. If you really saturate the board, the ebony will glow. The treatment has held up well on all of mine.

I may have some picks of the control cavity on one of my F-100s. I will check.

Ken

[Fred Finisher]

The telltale signs have to do with some obvious and less than obvious markings. The obvious being the fact that the two colors that were on the guitar are both still there as can be seen in the paint chips that go down to the hog body. The fact that the finish colors are applied over the base coats of lacquer is also a sign of how we did it back then. Refinishers many times use color as a base coat and then topcoat it. All of our colors were applied over clear base coats until we introduced the two part urethane base coats around '84. The less obvious sign is in the overspray patterns from the handle. We used the same handles for bass bodies, guitar bodies and necks. This means there are dots of color and or clear that appear in the same spots on every part being sprayed. I sent one of those handles to Gabe a while back so it might end up in "The Book". The Sunburst designation in the neck pocket is also from the factory. The woodshop separated bodies that needed to be finished Natural or Sunburst so that extra care was used to make sure they could make it all the way through finishing without fillers in visible areas and also to make sure we didn't use those bodies for another color. The other stamp in the neck pocket was an inspection mark. The color on this guitar, based on the way it shows up on my screen, is gold. We used the same gold, which was a powder mixed in clear lacquer, as a color by itself as well as a base coat for Candy Apple Red and Lemon Yellow. I hope this helps,
Fred

[KenC]

Fred,

Thank you for the detailed information! I think you've mentioned this before, but did the lower-cost finish on the '82-'83 SC and SB models go directly onto the wood? Or were they also sprayed over a clear base coat?

Ken

[Fred Finisher]

KenC,
By the time SCs and SBs came around, we were using a two part urethane base coat. The original bodies were mostly solid colors so the base coat was white. We were able to apply less coats to get the base built because of the higher solids in the urethane. The original intent was to topcoat the color and not polish the lacquer but the results were poor and we ended up polishing anyway. This is where the misinformation about urethane and polyester topcoats started as far as I can tell. The original urethanes were so hard, that polishing the scratches out was nearly impossible. They did however work well for base coats in order to speed up the finish process.
Fred

[KenC]

Thanks Fred!

[AA eron]

I love hearing all this history about how these guitars were finished, especially from the guy that actually did it. Thanks Fred!

I will get around to the setup this weekend; it needs it badly. I will report back and let you all know how it plays and sounds.

[Fred Finisher]

KenC and AA eron,
You're welcome. It's always nice to see these old guitars reappear.
Fred

[Miles Smiles]

I will get around to the setup this weekend; it needs it badly.

Be careful with the screws for height adjustment on the string saddles. Your's are looking pretty good, no rust. But if they don't move very easily you should let some oil creeping in before. They are originals and there's no replacement available.

[AA eron]

Miles, thanks for the heads up. These screws are in good shape, but they got a touch of penetrating oil anyway. Thy turn just just fine.

So I set it up according to the factory specs. First of all, I do need to make a new nut for it. The factory says .018" for the nut slot height , but this one is at .005 - .010. I continued with the setup anyway because I have to order a nut blank. I have to say, .093" clearance at the 22nd fret on the low E string seems pretty high to me. The same with the high E string at .062". When playing it, the action feels excessively high. I am not impressed. Admitedley, I don't know the exact numbers that I usually set my guitars to. I typically make sure the frets are level, set nut slot heights at .008 -.010", adjust the trussrod with as little refief as possible (probably about .010 -,012), and then adjust the saddles so the strings are low with no fretting out.

Also, setting the tremelo so that the bridge plate is an even 3/16" across the body, the bridge (and the tuning) seems pretty unstable. If I tighten up the tremelo screws a bit so that the bridge just points down toward the back of the guitar a touch, everything is much happier. I'm OK with this. There is still plenty of room to wammy up and down.

So I'm going to make a new nut, and see how level the frets are, and have another go at it. I only had about an hour to play with it this weekend.

[AA eron]

Well, last night I stayed up too late and made a new nut and filed a little relief in the higher frets, and then polished them. Then I ignored the factory setup specs and did things the way I like. It's a world of difference!. It plays better, sounds better, and stays in tune better- even with decent use of the wammy bar. I'm not a luthier, but I do set up and maintain my own guitars and friend's guitars, and I always overlook the importance of a properly made nut.

I'll snap a few pics tonight and take a few pics and post the numbers I used.