ASAT special with Bigsby issues

[Colin]

Hey - I just purchased a used ASAT special with Bigsby. I'm having issues with the bridge - it has a jaguar/jazzmaster style bridge - and I'm having trouble getting the saddles to stop vibrating/buzzing. I'm wondering if this bridge will be a direct swap for a mastery bridge - and if that would be the "holy grail" of upgrades. I'd appreciate any input.

[darwinohm]

Colin, I am going to take a shot at this since I have done several Bigsby conversions and they are often not done correctly. If you look at a G&L from the factory it will have a Bigsby B 5 with a Tuneomatic type bridge. The Bigsby is also routed into the body to have the correct sting angle. You obviously have something different if you have the Jazzmaster type bridge. First question is does your Special have a B5 Bigsby or an F Bigsby. With that bridge you will need an F Bigsby or a routed B 5. It sounds like you have a string angle problem. Are you using a chrome bridge cover? That will buzz. If you can post some close-up pictures of the Bigsby and bridge, I will try to help you. I am leaving shortly and will be unavailable until tomorrow late morning. The Bigsby's when done correctly are awesome. Don't even consider a bridge swap until we determine which Bigsby you have. -- Darwin

[Colin]

It's a non-F Bigsby, recessed into the body. It's a jaguar/jazzmaster style bridge, not a tuneomatic. It just seems like a poor design. The strings are spaced by sitting in the threads of the saddle pieces. I'd attach a picture, but I think I need more posts to do that.

[Craig]

It's a non-F Bigsby, recessed into the body. It's a jaguar/jazzmaster style bridge, not a tuneomatic. It just seems like a poor design. The strings are spaced by sitting in the threads of the saddle pieces. I'd attach a picture, but I think I need more posts to do that.

To post photos, see: Tutorial: Posting photos.

I don't know if this will help, but see setup asnd maintenance information on the Bigsby vibrato here http://www.bigsby.com/vibe/.

[Colin]

Here are some pictures:

http://i1351.photobucket.com/albums/p78 ... 1382725750

http://i1351.photobucket.com/albums/p78 ... 1382725918

[Colin]

[Craig]

Look's like a previous owner modded the bridge assembly. The stock bridge G&L uses is a Gotoh Tune-a-matic.
I suggest getting it back to the stock bridge assembly.

Here's a photo of an ASAT Deluxe with Bigsby:



Hope this helps.

[Colin]

I removed the bridge, and it looks like there are smooth inserts inside threaded thimbles. Problem is - they're pretty stuck in there. I wonder if there used to be a tunomatic bridge, and it has been replaced along the way, like you suggested. I didn't think the post spacing for a tunomatic bridge was the same as these jazzmaster-style bridges. I may have a go at getting the inserts out, while leaving the threaded thimbles in place.

[darwinohm]

Colin, the pictures help a lot. First of all, this looks like a standard G&L Bigsby installation with a modified bridge. I think someone has modified the bridge. Having said that, I think this may work okay. I see a problem which may cause your buzzing. If you look closely you will see that there are 2 different thread sizes on the saddles. This bridge is installed backwards with the coarse threads on the high string sides. That may be tyour source of buzzing, much the same as a nut cut too wide. If you want the saddle adjustment screws to the front of the bridge like you have it, remove the saddles and install the three course thread saddles on the large string side and the fine thread saddles on the high strings. That is what I would do rather than reversing the bridge. There are small hex screws in the saddle posts for adjusting the bridge height. I would solve the saddle issue and then lets see what happens to the buzz. I have more details if you need but one step at a time. I think this setup may work just fine unless you are a heavy picker or strummer. What would happen then is you strings would jump groves in the saddle rather than buzz. After setting the bridge up correctly you may have to raise the bridge and shim the neck accordingly to increase the string angle a bit but that is a different issue. BTW I like this saddle with the Bigsby because it is floating and returns to tune bertter than the tuneomatic. I have also experimented with roller bridges and do not car for them as they don't always return to tune.-- Darwin

[Fumble fingers]

Good eye Darwin !! ..... I had to look at it for awhile after you pointed it out just to see it .... they have the big/low strings with the fine thread and coarse threads on the high strings , great call Darwin

[Colin]

Wow good eye. I had to look closely at the actual guitar to see the difference in the threads. I'll turn the bridge around, re-setup and intonate, and see how it goes. I have a roller bridge on another guitar with a bigsby, and haven't had any issues (though I don't really do any crazy divebombs).

Problem is, I'm going to be out of town for 8 days - and wanting to mess around with this guitar the whole time. The neck is killer, and the pickups sounds very sweet.

[Colin]

So I took out the jazzmaster style bridge, and got a better look at the thimbles. The previous owner had put inserts inside the thimbles so the jazzmaster bridge fit snugly. Anyway, after trying to remove the inserts I quickly realized they were GLUED in. So after some more trying, I got 'em out (what a fiasco). What was left was TOM thimbles.

So I ordered a Tonepros TOM bridge and in the meantime, pulled the TOM with roller saddles off another guitar (also with a bigsby) and put it on this. It was ok, but thinned out the sound a bit. Enough for me to kinda wish I had the <censored word> JM bridge. Anyway - when the Tonepros came in I put that on, and it's looking, playing, and sounding like a million bucks.

Before putting the Tonepros on the G & L though - I tried it on the guitar that I took the TOM with roller saddles from, and it made that guitar much more awesome. So I'll probably order another bridge for that one in the future.

I've learned a lot about various bridges through this whole process, and one thing that stuck was how the roller saddles made otherwise awesome guitars sound pretty bad in comparison to the Tonepros non-roller. I only use the bigsby for light vibrato, so in the future I'm going to stay away from bridges with roller saddles.

[Craig]

So I took out the jazzmaster style bridge, and got a better look at the thimbles. The previous owner had put inserts inside the thimbles so the jazzmaster bridge fit snugly. Anyway, after trying to remove the inserts I quickly realized they were GLUED in. So after some more trying, I got 'em out (what a fiasco). What was left was TOM thimbles.

So I ordered a Tonepros TOM bridge and in the meantime, pulled the TOM with roller saddles off another guitar (also with a bigsby) and put it on this. It was ok, but thinned out the sound a bit. Enough for me to kinda wish I had the <censored word> JM bridge. Anyway - when the Tonepros came in I put that on, and it's looking, playing, and sounding like a million bucks.

Before putting the Tonepros on the G & L though - I tried it on the guitar that I took the TOM with roller saddles from, and it made that guitar much more awesome. So I'll probably order another bridge for that one in the future.

I've learned a lot about various bridges through this whole process, and one thing that stuck was how the roller saddles made otherwise awesome guitars sound pretty bad in comparison to the Tonepros non-roller. I only use the bigsby for light vibrato, so in the future I'm going to stay away from bridges with roller saddles.

Thanks for posting this followup, Colin. I'm sure others will find your findings of interest; I sure did.

[darwinohm]

Very interesting post Colin. I was not totally satisified with the TOM on my G&L Asat at first. I replaced it with Schaller Roller bridge which I did not like either. I found that the TOM on the Asat is designed to rock a bit and I cleaned it well, lubed the posts and it has worked well since. The Jazzmaster bridge will only work with the F BIgsby. I am surprised that the person who installed it did use the pivot feature on Jazz bridge. There are a lot of butchered Bigsby installations out there. Glad to hear you are happy. I am sure happy with mine. -- Darwin