Replacing 1st gen F-100 pickups

[gorilic1]

I have a 1980-81? F-100. I never have been satisfied with the stock MFD pickups. I picked up an old made in USA Peavey awhile back with just a cheap rear humbucker and it sounded better than my F-100 in rear double coil mode. Has anyone ever done a switch? Can I just replace them and keep the electronics the same? I want to keep the coil splitter. I am pretty sure the body would have to be routed as well. I know that this would probably reduce the value of the guitar but I figure that since it isn't mint anyway, that should'nt matter much. If I wasn't so crazy about the quality and feel of this particular guitar, I would just get something else. Ideas?

[Craig]

I have a 1980-81? F-100. I never have been satisfied with the stock MFD pickups. I picked up an old made in USA Peavey awhile back with just a cheap rear humbucker and it sounded better than my F-100 in rear double coil mode. Has anyone ever done a switch? Can I just replace them and keep the electronics the same? I want to keep the coil splitter. I am pretty sure the body would have to be routed as well. I know that this would probably reduce the value of the guitar but I figure that since it isn't mint anyway, that should'nt matter much. If I wasn't so crazy about the quality and feel of this particular guitar, I would just get something else. Ideas?

This post might be of some help: F-100 vs 25th Anniversary PUP's.

Hope this helps.

[Elwood]

I have a 1980-81? F-100. I never have been satisfied with the stock MFD pickups. I picked up an old made in USA Peavey awhile back with just a cheap rear humbucker and it sounded better than my F-100 in rear double coil mode. Has anyone ever done a switch? Can I just replace them and keep the electronics the same? I want to keep the coil splitter. I am pretty sure the body would have to be routed as well. I know that this would probably reduce the value of the guitar but I figure that since it isn't mint anyway, that should'nt matter much. If I wasn't so crazy about the quality and feel of this particular guitar, I would just get something else. Ideas?

I would stay away from routing it...though not mint these are getting more popular all the time and
as you noticed, the build quality is cream of the crop.
I would consider bypassing the tone controls first . I think that is really where things get muddy on the F-100's.
I love the Peavey T-series buckers, just because folks haven't caught on bigtime doesn't make them any less stellar. (Red Rhodes had a hand in the design and the tone circuit) ...so I hear ya loud and clear.

I bought an old F-100 body and neck , so I was free to try a few things.
I put two single coil MFDs (older ones) in place of the buckers and wired it up so I had plenty of options,
It sings and cuts through the mix better than most passive F-100's.
So there are reversible options, be patient and try some things .
Take some pics of the guts though before changing anything, so it's easy to troubleshoot should something go wonky. My old F-100 is pretty beat-up , I still treat her like the royalty that she is .
(and look at the price of an old Fender Strat without any wood or finish purposely taken out )
Leo didn't cut any corners when he started G&L ...these guitars are godly !

and welcome !!!
do you have any pics of your F-100...we love pics

elwood

[Craig]

I have a 1980-81? F-100. I never have been satisfied with the stock MFD pickups. I picked up an old made in USA Peavey awhile back with just a cheap rear humbucker and it sounded better than my F-100 in rear double coil mode. Has anyone ever done a switch? Can I just replace them and keep the electronics the same? I want to keep the coil splitter. I am pretty sure the body would have to be routed as well. I know that this would probably reduce the value of the guitar but I figure that since it isn't mint anyway, that should'nt matter much. If I wasn't so crazy about the quality and feel of this particular guitar, I would just get something else. Ideas?

This post might be of some help: F-100 vs 25th Anniversary PUP's.

Hope this helps.

Another post to check out: NGD: 1980 G&L F-100 Series I (Searching for F-100 Info)

[KenC]

Please think twice - or as often as it takes - before permanently modding an early F-100!

In my experience, there is a tremendous difference in tone between ash and mahogany bodies on these guitars. My '80 ash F-100 is very bright sounding, which my '81 'hog is anything but bright. Which do you have? That could definitely come into play in thinking about options for getting the tone where you want it to be.

One other thing to keep in mind is that G&L circuits can be very different from other manufacturers'. Just about every guitar or bass I've owned prior to finding G&L had been designed to run with the controls wide open, and got dull pretty quickly when any knobs were rolled back. With most of my G&Ls it's just the opposite. The sweet spot is somewhere down toward the middle of each control pot, so setting everything on ten can get a bit harsh sounding. Roll them back a bit, and the magic happens.

Ken

[Boogie Bill]

What amp do you use, what kind of music do you play, what kind of strings?

What don't you like about the pickup?

How do you set your guitar's tone controls? Your amp? What is your pedal chain?

Hang in there, I may have some ideas for you.

Bill

[louis cyfer]

What amp do you use, what kind of music do you play, what kind of strings?

What don't you like about the pickup?

How do you set your guitar's tone controls? Your amp? What is your pedal chain?

Hang in there, I may have some ideas for you.

Bill

and these are the relevant questions.

[gorilic1]

I play through a Carvin X 60. 60 watt tube amp. Never get above 3 though. I have an RP 100 that I sometimes play through. It does scream when I turn it up and the sustain is awesome however when I try to play clean, it is lacking. Doesn't really do the single coil sound very well like on a strat or a p-90, and it doesn't really do the humbucker sound, such as on a Gibson very well either. I play mostly blues, folk, and some metal/rock. Will be playing tonight and will try the tone adjustments. As far as wiring, I'm not sure. Simple stuff I can do as long as I know exactly what to do.

[louis cyfer]

I play through a Carvin X 60. 60 watt tube amp. Never get above 3 though. I have an RP 100 that I sometimes play through. It does scream when I turn it up and the sustain is awesome however when I try to play clean, it is lacking. Doesn't really do the single coil sound very well like on a strat or a p-90, and it doesn't really do the humbucker sound, such as on a Gibson very well either. I play mostly blues, folk, and some metal/rock. Will be playing tonight and will try the tone adjustments. As far as wiring, I'm not sure. Simple stuff I can do as long as I know exactly what to do.

most humbuckers will not split to a good single coils sound. the f100 is definitely not the same as a traditional humbucker sound though. what don't you like about the clean channel?

[Boogie Bill]

I seems to me that your expectatons are at fault, not the guitar. Dont feel bad...we all do this at times.

The F-100 is a unique guitar....it is not a strat, nor a Les Paul. It will NEVER sound like those guitars. It is UNIQUE. Even if you change pickups, it will not give you those sounds.

We all look for the one guitar that will do it all, but it doesn't exist. Or the single channel tube amp that can handle any gig and sound like a BF Fender AND a Marshall. Nope.

So you have to give up that expectation. It's a mind-set that causes a lot of stress and frustration...and it can get real expensive chasing a dream.

You should read my post "Comanches For Dummies" that Craig has archived in the Knowledge Base. It deals with this issue, and how I found MY tone with the Comanche...and how I had to free my mind from the expectations.

Practically, you can try a couple of things. A graphic eq pedal like the Boss 6-band or the MXR 10-band can be used to drop the 2K band. It takes out some of the aggression of the MFD, giving is a tone closer to a vintage single coil. And it can help get closer to a PAF tone.

I use my PTB controls with the treble on 10 and the bass on 5, and then I set my from there. I do this with all my PTB guitars and my active eq Music Man Sabre II, the predecessor of the F-100. Makes it easy to go from bright and twangy to sweet and mellow by just rolling down the guitar's treble pot.

You might want to consider a Legacy HB for strat tones with a bridge bucker. The Legacy 2HB and the ASAT Deluxe give you good single coil tones when split and full humbucker tones in normal mode. Neither will sound like a Gibson Les Paul though.

Remember, the F-100 is a unique sounding guitar. Take those tones and and OWN THEM. Find YOUR tone in there. It might be that you've been looking to copy tones, not realizing that what you have sounds pretty darn good. Been there, done that.

Remember to enjoy the journey. You will learn a LOT about yourself. Most of all, be happy and thankful and keep on making music.

Take care,

Bill

[Elwood]

I had a Carvin tube amp for a while, I can't remember the model, it always sounded like a there was a blanket over the sound. It could have been something as simple as changing out the first preamp tube for a better one.
I didn't know enough about tube amps back then to try some options before I sold it.
Is there a master volume on yours? Opening up the master almost to ten , then using the pre volume(s)
to attenuate can bring some more dynamics and punch to the tone equation.
I've had just the opposite experience with a couple F-100's as far as clean vs dirt goes. I could get brilliant cleans but was underwhelmed with some of my overdrive options.
...just brainstorming here ; Have you played with pickup height ?
Those MFDs are powerful and can dampen string vibration if too close. That might not be as noticible in an overdrive situation if it's happening.
I might pull out one of my stock F-100's tonight to see if that spurs any other ideas.

Bill and Louis are right on the money with their advice .




elwood

[gorilic1]

There is a lot in all of your replies. I especially like your take on expectations Bill. Reminds me of my older VW days when I wanted more horsepower out of the small air-cooled engine. It finally took a very experience VW guy to just flat out say that if I wanted a faster car, then buy one that was faster and stop trying to make something different than what it was designed for. In my continued search for tone, I have two more questions: Is there any particular amplifier that might be more compatible? Lower wattage maybe? Highest I ever get is to 3. Also, any specific pedals apart from the equalizers that might enhance a cleaner tone?

[Katefan]

I think Bill's on to something with rolling down the bass control. Just read a Guitar Player interview from the 80's with Country Western guitarist Roy Lanham. Long time friend of Leo's. He states in the interview that his main guitar besides 2 Music Mans is a current model G&L with 3 knobs (probably an F-100) He mentions that Leo removed one of the controls on it so there's just Vol and Tone - says it was a welcomed addition.

I also recall Gabe mentioning that the placement of the PU's on the F-100 is a big factor sound-wise more than the pickup design...

I'm with Elwood - modding it via routing it may be something you one day regret. Leo-era G&L's are FINALLY starting to rise in monetary value - early F-100's are top notch in terms of build quality and being the flagship model for G&L they could really take off $/collector-wise.

Amp-wise, SF Fender Champs and other low wattage models are hard to beat in the clean realm.


Cheers,
KF