Warmoth Split Jazz, CHAMBERED Korina w/Birds Eye Maple Top

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Sun Jan 08, 2012 12:30 am

This is what I have in build right now. With the split jazz there is no switch allowance for a rhythm circuit, so I was hoping to have a PTB system wired in the guitar with a push pull on the bottom tone for a planned split circuit single coil (a Curtis Novak JM-180) at the bridge. The neck will remain a vintage spec Jazzmaster pickup. Seems to me that Jazzmaster died right around the time Leo filed his patent for PTB. I'm thinking that he'd have put it into the next evolution of the JM if he was able to. Any thoughts to this approach?

This wiring is not something I wish to tackle myself- any reccomendations for whom I can send the pickups and pickgaurd to to have it done would be GREATLY appreciated. Understanding the PTB system is key...

Also, I "What would George and Leo do" question: The Jazzmaster bridge configuration has been a sore subject for most who seriously play it. I have thoughts of mimicking the new Fender Classic Player Jazzmaster by moving the trem closer to the bridge for a greater string tension and a steeper breakover angle than original. I had Warmoth route for the bridge, but not the trem. So, what would G&L do if they were building a Jag/Jazz style tremolo bridge today?

louis cyfer · Post by **louis cyfer** » Sun Jan 08, 2012 1:11 am

the only suggestion i would make is a push push instead of the push pull switch, much easier to switch on the fly.

Ahryn · Post by **Ahryn** » Sun Jan 08, 2012 1:23 am

I love the look of Jazzmasters but have been scared off by the problematic bridge, your mock up looks great though.

You could mess with peoples perceptions and throw a Bigsby on it.

Oh and I am sure the PTB wiring schematic is hiding somewhere on this site....

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Sun Jan 08, 2012 1:33 am

louis cyfer wrote:the only suggestion i would make is a push push instead of the push pull switch, much easier to switch on the fly.

Thank you, louis cyfer, that didn't occur to me!

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Sun Jan 08, 2012 2:12 pm

Ahryn wrote:I love the look of Jazzmasters but have been scared off by the problematic bridge, your mock up looks great though.

You could mess with peoples perceptions and throw a Bigsby on it.

Oh and I am sure the PTB wiring schematic is hiding somewhere on this site....

I just can't get my head around the Bigsby on the JM. I don't want to cover up the birdseye maple with a hunk of hardware...I've also never played one.

louis cyfer · Post by **louis cyfer** » Sun Jan 08, 2012 5:32 pm

JagInTheBag wrote:
Ahryn wrote:I love the look of Jazzmasters but have been scared off by the problematic bridge, your mock up looks great though.

You could mess with peoples perceptions and throw a Bigsby on it.

Oh and I am sure the PTB wiring schematic is hiding somewhere on this site....

I just can't get my head around the Bigsby on the JM. I don't want to cover up the birdseye maple with a hunk of hardware...I've also never played one.

the bigsby is not much bigger than the stock piece and it mounts to the strap button, no need to do any routing.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:32 pm

Here is a rendering of the back, nuttin' but Korina and vintage tint...enjoy!

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Mon Jan 09, 2012 5:41 pm

Does anyone have any experience with a Wilkinson "Wigsby" style tremolo? This thing has an interesting look about it. I also like the idea of adjustable tension.

Post by **gitman001** » Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:44 am

Hey Jag,

How is the build coming? I recently got the idea that i would do a build of a jazz master ( i have never done a build before) - Then i stubbled upon this thread and see you have one on the go!

I was thinking of going with MFD's and a saddle lock, or maybe a bigsby. Are you happy with the Warmoth stuff so far?

Scott

Elwood · Post by **Elwood** » Sun Feb 12, 2012 6:22 am

JagInTheBag wrote:Does anyone have any experience with a Wilkinson "Wigsby" style tremolo?

I hadn't seen the Wigsby before.
If the Hallmark reproductions are fairly true to the real deal Mosrites they are modeled after,
that would be another no route option. I love the action on my Mosrite bar.

http://www.hallmarkguitars.com/parts/parts.htm

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Mon Feb 13, 2012 10:58 am

This one is still several weeks away from coming form Warmoth. I am leaning toward the Fender vibrato with a Mustang Modified Bridge, simply placing the vibrato closer to the bridge, just like the new "Classic Player" series. Althought, they use the "Adjust-O-Matic" bridge.

Stay tuned!

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Sat Feb 25, 2012 12:20 am

The body and neck shipped from Warmoth, should be here by the 29th!

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Wed Feb 29, 2012 5:45 pm

They are here and it looks SWEET! Ordered the pups this evening, just pulling together the rest of the parts. Photos later...

kakerlak · Post by **kakerlak** » Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:28 am

I'd yet to click on this b/c I'd assumed this was some sort of Jazz bass project...

I have a '64 Jazzmaster and one thing few people mention regarding the stock JM bridge setup is how far the factory bridge can be raised. I have mine up near the limit of its adjustment range and the neck shimmed back accordingly (if you wanted, you could go higher w/ longer set screws). Set up that way, there's enough back angle to keep the strings in their place.

I also cut a bar of aluminum and drilled it so it mounts with the two forwardmost tailpiece mounting screws. With the high bridge and the homemade stringtree in place, there's a lot of tension behind the bridge and the guitar has more of a tele/strat spank to the natural acoustic sound. With that in place, there's probably too much tension/lash for the vibrato to work very well, but I never use it anyway. I like it both ways, honestly. I found out later that there's a product called a "Buzzstop" that mounts the same way my homemade piece does and has a roller for the string-contacting surface. It's probably a pretty good part and my memory is that they're $35 or so new.

I think you'll be happiest with the stock setup, at least appearance-wise.

My '64 is just about the best sounding guitar ever. I have noticed that many of the aftermarket pickups out there seem to throw around words like "fat" that would make me a bit hesitant. For reference, my original Fender pickups are somewhere around 4k and most of the aftermarket options seem much higher resistance. I'm not sure they'd retain the proper liveliness and brilliance of the real deal.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:41 am

Kakerlak,

I have a '65 Jaguar that is restored to exact factory specs. This is a restomodded version of the Jazzmaster. Moving the vibrato closer to the bridge amounts to same effect as the wizzo buzz stop and still lets you use the vibrato. The pups I am using are Curtis Novak hand wound units, the neck will be the same specs as original, the bridge is going to be an overwound P90 spec single coil called the "P180", the coil tap will give me a P90, untapped a double wound "P180". I am very excited about this project. Fingers crossed!

~Patrick

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:44 am

gitman001 wrote:Hey Jag,

How is the build coming? I recently got the idea that i would do a build of a jazz master ( i have never done a build before) - Then i stubbled upon this thread and see you have one on the go! I was thinking of going with MFD's and a saddle lock, or maybe a bigsby. Are you happy with the Warmoth stuff so far?

Scott

Got the body and neck a couple days ago. Fit and finish seem to be very good. There was some roughness to the headstock near the nut, but only to the touch, not that one could see. I suspect once the waterslides are on and headstock gets a coat of clear poly, you won't notice even that.

~Patrick

kakerlak · Post by **kakerlak** » Fri Mar 02, 2012 11:59 am

JagInTheBag wrote:Kakerlak,

I have a '65 Jaguar that is restored to exact factory specs. This is a restomodded version of the Jazzmaster. Moving the vibrato closer to the bridge amounts to same effect as the wizzo buzz stop and still lets you use the vibrato. The pups I am using are Curtis Novak hand wound units, the neck will be the same specs as original, the bridge is going to be an overwound P90 spec single coil called the "P180", the coil tap will give me a P90, untapped a double wound "P180". I am very excited about this project. Fingers crossed!

~Patrick

If it was me and I wasn't concerned too much about it looking like a Jazzmaster, I'd be tempted to put a Bigsby B-5 on it and some sort of modern T-o-M roller bridge.

Not being able to view pics at work, it's not clear to me whether you've already received a routed body or are still contemplating the coice of tailpice, so it might be a moot point. I like the looks of the stock photo at the start of the thread, though. That shape looks really cool with the birdseye top. It's got a bit of an old timey vibe to it.

Post by **gitman001** » Sat Mar 03, 2012 8:44 am

Hey Patrick,

I hope you can get around to posting some pics! I would love to see it. I too am curious if you had them route the bridge and pickups. I was going to order mine finished at the factory and planned on routing it out after the fact. That is the part that makes me a little nervous.

Scott

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Sun Mar 04, 2012 2:32 pm

gitman001 wrote:Hey Patrick,

I hope you can get around to posting some pics! I would love to see it. I too am curious if you had them route the bridge and pickups. I was going to order mine finished at the factory and planned on routing it out after the fact. That is the part that makes me a little nervous.

Scott

Ask and ye shall receive!

(Old project pics removed)

Elwood · Post by **Elwood** » Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:32 pm

Wow !!!

Ahryn · Post by **Ahryn** » Sun Mar 04, 2012 3:55 pm

That is a real beauty!

Words did not do it justice.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Sun Mar 04, 2012 4:28 pm

Ahryn wrote:That is a real beauty!

Words did not do it justice.

Thanks Ahryn, I cannot wait to get her assembled!

~JagInTheBag

Post by **gitman001** » Sun Mar 04, 2012 6:41 pm

Hey Patrick,

That looks awesome

. I was thinking of reverse headstock as well, thanks for being the guinea pig! Be sure to keep us posted on its progress, can't wait to see it assembled. I think i will need to place my order sooner than later, GAS pains are really flaring up. That should fill the void while the GbL v2 gets all figured out.

Scott

darwinohm · Post by **darwinohm** » Sun Mar 04, 2012 7:15 pm

Patrick, this thing is awesome. It is a perfect candidate for an "F" Bigsby with the Jazzmaster bridge, an absolutely perfect combination. -- Darwin

kakerlak · Post by **kakerlak** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 9:29 am

Man that's pretty! You could even argue that the back is prettier than the front. I also like the B/R/B pickguard lamination, slick touch.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 10:03 am

darwinohm wrote:Patrick, this thing is awesome. It is a perfect candidate for an "F" Bigsby with the Jazzmaster bridge, an absolutely perfect combination. -- Darwin

I've never played one Darwin. How does it play compared to the Jag/Jazz bridge?

I did some research and found this homebuilt thinline as the only one that looks good with the Bigsby.

If I was doing a hollow body, I'd likely make the same choice.

darwinohm · Post by **darwinohm** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 10:20 am

Patrick, that is the one and that is the bridge you would use. You would not use the chrome bridge plate. It would look better without it as it is only used the cover the old bridgeplate area on a Tele. -- Darwin

kakerlak · Post by **kakerlak** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 10:28 am

JagInTheBag wrote:
darwinohm wrote:Patrick, this thing is awesome. It is a perfect candidate for an "F" Bigsby with the Jazzmaster bridge, an absolutely perfect combination. -- Darwin

I've never played one Darwin.

I presume you are talking about a "F" logo B5 tail piece seen most often on Tele's.

How is the action on one of those compared to a Jazz/Jag vibrato?

I'd prefer it. Bigsbys are nice and smooth and lend themselves to fast vibrato better than others. I always thought vintage Fender vibratos had too much flex in the arm itself. Makes the whole thing a little sluggish to react and fragile feeling, even if there's not any real likelihood of anything breaking. The JM is the worst in that department b/c it's got such a long arm.

Regarding the Bigsby itself, I know you can buy a tele kit that comes w/ the "F" branded B-5, a flat tele bridge plate in the outline of the bridge cover and a Jazzmaster bridge, but I don't know if you can get just the "F" Bigsby by itself. Of course, you don't exactly have a "Fender," so a regular B-5 ought to look ok, too.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 10:49 am

kakerlak wrote: Regarding the Bigsby itself, I know you can buy a tele kit that comes w/ the "F" branded B-5, a flat tele bridge plate in the outline of the bridge cover and a Jazzmaster bridge, but I don't know if you can get just the "F" Bigsby by itself. Of course, you don't exactly have a "Fender," so a regular B-5 ought to look ok, too.

I have "F's" all over the rest of the guitar, may as well stay consistent.

My main concern is that on all the other guitars with contoured bodies like mine the Bigsby looked like a stuck on piece.

darwinohm · Post by **darwinohm** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 11:38 am

A point of caution. I have installed several Bigsbys and if you use a B% the body needs too be routed because of the string angle. That is why the F Bigsby works so well with the Jazzmaster type bridge. The string roller on the F is closer to the bridge than the B5 therefore giving a better bridge string angle. Most Luthiers will not touch this project and I have done several. I also know of several that have used the B5 on flattop bodies and have not been at all happy with them and the only fix is to route the body. Two eles that I have done are played by working musicians abd neither one of them would part with theirs. They do not have tuning issues and return to tune with the Jazzmaster bridge. G&L uses the B5 on their ASATS and there is a reason why they are routed. I would not recommend using a tuneomatic bridge either although G&L does. The Jazzmaster bridge is a perfect compliment with a Bigsby as it is a true rocker bridge. Trust me, I have researched this and what I have learned about this is not by accident. Homework and a perfect installation are a must for a Bigsby installation. Patrick, Here is a picture of a Bluesboy that I did about a year ago. I did post photo step by step on the forum if you are interested.-- Darwin

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 1:31 pm

darwinohm wrote:A point of caution. I have installed several Bigsbys and if you use a B% the body needs too be routed because of the string angle. That is why the F Bigsby works so well with the Jazzmaster type bridge. The string roller on the F is closer to the bridge than the B5 therefore giving a better bridge string angle.

Darwin, how far is the string roller from the "F" from your bridge on the Tele?

darwinohm · Post by **darwinohm** » Mon Mar 05, 2012 2:09 pm

Patrick, I do not have a tele here to measure but here is a picture of a 52 Tele reissue that I did alongside my Asat Z-3 and the difference is very noticeable. The bridge on the Tele is a Jazzmaster, it just has the chrome cover.--Darwin

nascarbean_97 · Post by **nascarbean_97** » Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:42 pm

That back...

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:08 pm

Brought the parts over the my luthier for assembly and worked through the electronics. Going with a Push-Push 500k Volume w/coil tap, a 250k treble rolloff with Push-Push series tap, and a 500k bass rolloff. I'll keep you posted!

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Thu Jul 19, 2012 11:38 am

I have had the guitar for a while now and have gigged with it. She is butter smooth and beautiful! Check her out:

"Fender" Split-JazzMaster by ShowYourAuto!com, on Flickr

darwinohm · Post by **darwinohm** » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:20 pm

Yup, she is a beauty!-- Darwin

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:25 pm

darwinohm wrote:Yup, she is a beauty!-- Darwin

+1 Thanks Darwin!

Elwood · Post by **Elwood** » Thu Jul 19, 2012 1:50 pm

darwinohm wrote:Yup, she is a beauty!-- Darwin

No doubt ,very tasteful but it stands out ....AND it looks like a blast to play, well done sir !
The spalted body just puts it over the top.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:07 pm

Glad you all enjoy my "RestaMZzaL".

louis cyfer · Post by **louis cyfer** » Thu Jul 19, 2012 8:20 pm

that is very nice. push push is such a better way to go for ease of use. that body turned out about as good as it could.

JagInTheBag · Post by **JagInTheBag** » Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:04 am

louis cyfer wrote:that is very nice. push push is such a better way to go for ease of use. that body turned out about as good as it could.

Thank you louis, I know how much you appreciate a wood finish.