Lunch Report - Monday February 28th, early report

[astutzmann]

My name is Alf and I just turned 54 years old. I have lived most of my life in Toronto, but for the past 6 years moved to the Niagara Falls area of Canada, about 1/2 hour north of Buffalo.

I am honored to be the lunch reporter for this week but am nervous since I am a newbie to the forum, the lunch reports and to playing the guitar in general, let alone G&Ls. Humbling to be amongst all the musicians on this site! I learn something new every day from you folks, thanks!

I have an introduction at the bottom of this post, if you want to read it. If not, that's cool too, that's why I put it at the bottom.

LUNCH

About 90 minutes from my home is Ellicottville, NY and the Holiday Valley Resort. My wife and I are going there this morning, will be skiing this afternoon, meeting friends for dinner and staying over. I hope to ski tomorrow morning and get back home late in the afternoon. Hence the early report.

So, I already know that lunch for both today and tomorrow will be eaten at the Yodeler Lodge in Holiday Valley. The food is pretty good there (surprisingly) and I always go for their home made chicken noodle soup and a salad from their salad bar. Great lunch when you are skiing! I used to get the burgers or pizza, but................... u know. So, soup and salad it will be!

G&L QUESTION

OK, I'll start the week with what might be an old question, sorry if its been answered before. I have been reading the posts about folks with G&Ls who try to go back to a strat and can't, strats feels like crap, compared to the G&L.

I was recently in a music store that USED to carry G&Ls, mostly Tributes. The store has recently converted over to Fender exclusively (booooooooooo!). I asked the owner why and he said its all about marketing, kids want a strat and in our consumer laden environment, the higher the price of the strat, the better it has to be (to them). Most expensive he had was an American Deluxe (it sure was pretty).

He then told me, too bad cause he loved the G&L US models and said that no one could beat their necks, especially the way their made..... He just couldnt sell them..................

So, what is it about G&Ls and especially their necks, that make them so special to you, in your hands? What's the love you feel for them? Whats so different in the way they make their necks that make em so hard and good?

I guess that's a bunch of questions but you get my drift....

Followup and just curious, do you think G&L should do a compound radius neck?

NON G&L QUESTION (is about passion)

My dad hated hockey and so he took us skiing. I was a ski instructor at age 18 and have been a skiing for 48 years now and love it more than ever. I guess I'm pretty good at it and that is what makes and drives my passion for it. Every day when skiing, I try to get better at it. I assume that if I had played guitar for a very long time and was pretty good at it, I would feel the same way. Is that the case?

I believe that there comes a point when you are starting out with guitar that something clicks, your passion develops and you can't put the thing down, play for hours....Is that true? I haven't hit that yet and would like to. How can I help make that happen? I love playing (as bad as I am) but would really love to develop that passion for it.

Followup, what other things like skiing are you passionate about (keep it clean), skiing, golf, ????

INTRO

Being of German descent, my parents made me take 3+ years of accordion lessons when I was 8. I hated it, hated practicing, but ... I found music theory to be very interesting and passed grade 4.

In high school I played the clarinet for 2 years, gave it up too, but since then have always wanted a sax...the cool part was, I could read the music!

I had a very fortunate and lucky career for 30 years in the high tech, networking area. Unfortunately it was a workaholic environment and spent a lot of years working 60-80+ hours/week and I never thought about playing music the whole time.

When I sorta retired, I was thinking of trying something musical and while we had a piano, it didn't do much to inspire me. So, I decided at age 50 to take up the guitar. Being completely left sided, I thought why not, go buy a lefty and see what happens.

I bought a new Tanglewood acoustic for $199 and signed up for lessons. It was unplayable and I'm sure it was the guitar, not me, so after 6 months, I traded it for a Norman ST68 (much nicer).

I took my lessons at the store and they talked me into my first electric, a fender strat for $399 (don't even know what kind of strat it was, MIJ, MIM??). I tried to play it for a while but it was a POS and I was sooo pissed at it, I threw it into a dumpster (I know, sorry).

I decided to get a good guitar and change teachers, found a phenomenal instructor who I am still with (masters degree in music, specializing in classical guitar, from the UK) and he turned me on to G&L. Being a techie engineering type, I did my research and ordered my ASAT Classic Semi-Hollow Bluesboy, spanish copper metallic. Its a 2008 model and it took 15 weeks to come from the factory (remember, its a lefty). Biggest decisions were color, pickguard, all cosmetic. What did I know.

This guitar is a player, now its up to me to learn so I can one day be good enough and not be humbled by this wonderful guitar!

This one great guitar got me hooked, now have 5 with 2 more on order. If I was right handed, I would have even more, lol. I have GAS.

My other G&L is a 2009 legacy, vintage white and I love it even more than the bluesboy right now (ooops, my inner voice speaking). Its awesome and I think its the 12 degree neck that I'm liking over the 7.5 on the bluesboy. Right now I can't find a thing that I don't like about the legacy.

I also have a 2011 ASAT Special Deluxe on order, locking tuners, ss frets and I can't wait to here that baby!

So, I have been playing 4 years, am certainly not a beginner anymore, but still stink at it. Unlike when I was a kid, I have stuck with it and haven't given up, even on the most frustrating days! I have learned to read tabs and am working on being able to read the music and the tabs at the same time since tabs don't really give the timing of the notes.

My wife and I love music, especially LIVE music and we go to see bands, alot. Last year for our 30th anniversary, we went to the Clapton Crossroads Guitar Festival in Chicago..............we were blown away and yesterday I watched the DVD of the concert! ITs great.

I have to thank Southpawguy for turning me onto this and other guitar forums (the lefty kinds).

Alf Stutzmann, retired engineer and <censored word> guitar player

[BillEvans1956]

Hi Alf,

Welcome and well done for taking on the LR role for this week. It ain't so scary once you get started, and it's great to hear from other forum members across the globe. That's a great first post there. Thanks.

Like you, I'm 54 years 'young' and having great fun with my (three) G&L guitars; one USA Legacy, and two ASAT Special Deluxe (one standard, one custom). I can't justify buying any more though!

Bill

[astutzmann]

HI Bill:

Thanks.

I have a 2011 ASAT Special Deluxe on order, locking tuners, graphtech nut and SS frets, I am so excited, cant wait.....

[Sprinter 92]

G&L QUESTION

Followup and just curious, do you think G&L should do a compound radius neck?

I played a Fender, American Deluxe Stratocaster last weekend and the compound radius neck on it was very nice! Yes, I think G&L should offer compound radius necks.

NON G&L QUESTION (is about passion)

Followup, what other things like skiing are you passionate about (keep it clean), skiing, golf, ????

I'm passionate about ATV's & dirt track racing! I find golf, football, baseball, etc. to be slow and NASCAR is boring. I can tolerate basketball & hockey. Too me there is nothing more exciting than watching sprint cars going sideways through a corner!



I love my two ATV's too!




Nice start, Alf!


Sprinter 92

[legacyman]

Hey Alf,

Welcome aboard & don't be nervous about being a newbe, I'm one too & 58 yrs young, so just be youself & everything will be just fine!

LUNCH: I had some fried chicken w/bakebeans and for desert, chocolate pie w/whipped cream!!

BTW, thanks for your post in the intro section, I haven't had a chance to respond yet because I'm having a hard time putting down that new Vintage White Legacy I just got a couple of days ago. That Vintage White sure is purty isn't it! I know, I know, it doesn't exist without pics. I'm trying to borrow my sister's digital camera so I can take some pics. So please be patient with me!

Well, I'll tell ya, I can't exactly explain just what it is about the neck (12" Radius #1 Classic shape), but it just feels really good in my hand. It feels a little beefier maybe, not fat, but just more solid & smooth. I've owned a couple of strats, one was 9.5" & one was 12". But the 12" on the strat still didn't feel the same as the Legacy neck! There's just no comparison IMHO! I just wish I would have discovered G&L sooner. I mean, I had heard of them, I just didn't take them seriously enough to actually sit down and play one! I have never played a compound neck, so I can't really comment on it!

My passion has always been MUSIC!! Either playing or listening to all kinds of music because I've been involved with it since I was 6 yrs old. Piano first, then violin, then cello for about 4 yrs and even the drums for a while until I discovered the guitar at age 15.
I have lots of other hobbies, just not that passionate about them, although I too love skiing!

Looking forward to your Lunch Reports this week. Good Luck!!-Rod

[willross]

I love skiing. Had a huge accident after a race in 1988, but still love it. Minnesota is a bit thin in this department. Although they have a few smaller slopes up north.

I was introduced to G&L when trading-in an American Strat LH(white on white w/rail in bridge pos, but kept original). The owner recommended an S-500. There were no guitars to try out, but I went for it. I later had Tone-Guard take a crack at it...



Have a great trip!



Will

[yowhatsshakin]

Hey Alf,

Welcome to the ranks of Lunch Reporters! Don't worry about asking questions that might have been asked before. I for one like to answer some questions over and over again; especially G&L related ones. Talk about a passion

One of the main reasons I got addicted to G&L's is their neck. Mind you, it is not a specific neck profile. I have #1's, #2's, #2a's, #2b's, and #4's, and love each one of them. They all seem to match my big hands comfortably. I have no experience with compound radius necks, so I have to suspend an opinion on that.

Beyond guitars and G&L's in particular, I have several other 'passions'. (Nuclear) physics, in which I got my PhD, and its close associates math and astronomy, are still near and dear to my heart and I like to keep up on them. Secondly, I have a passion for the agile approach for software development. The work 'agile' is misused frequently in the field hence I will not even start explaining what it actually is. Suffice it to say that it merely emphasizes a set of common sense practices which I like to convey to my 'graduate' student: Computer Science majors fresh from college who usually know how to hack but not how to write commercial software. Thirdly, I am a complete '45-'75 American space program nut. I love to read, watch, and talk about Redstone, Thor, Atlas, Titan, Mercury, Gemini, Apollo up to the Apollo-Soyuz project. Strangely enough, the space shuttle never really caught my fancy although I do follow the missions.

BTW, it is more important that you enjoy playing your instrument than how proficient (or not) you are on it. If you like to play, you will get better. I saw Eric Clapton in concert yesterday evening and that man plays so effortlessly, it might cause you to give up the guitar if you're in the wrong mindset. But I know I am no Clapton, so I just enjoyed it and felt inspired to try some new things and work on some techniques. I just try to be the best that I can be, however inefficient that may be compared to other players. I hope you do too.

- Jos

[blargfromouterspace]

Hi Alf, sounds like you're having fun in your retirement - skiing, two G&L's on order.... great stuff! I too have an SH Bluesboy in Spanish Copper, what a great colour. I've seen yours on G&Ls Facebook page (I'm not stalking you, just noticed your name) its a real beauty.

Hobbies: I can't afford other hobbies than music at the moment (I'm a student....). I started biathlon training a couple of years ago but couldn't afford to buy any of the skiing/shooting gear, let alone the cost of accommodation on the mountain. One day, one day...

I do enjoy cooking though, and have people over for dinner just about every week. I guess I'd say I'm passionate about it.

I believe that there comes a point when you are starting out with guitar that something clicks, your passion develops and you can't put the thing down, play for hours....Is that true? I haven't hit that yet and would like to. How can I help make that happen? I love playing (as bad as I am) but would really love to develop that passion for it.

It is true. You still hit 'plateaus', times when you feel like you aren't developing and that your playing is stuck, but perseverance gets you through. As for making it happen, you have to practice! No way around it. If you love playing then you're most of the way there already, that sounds like passion to me. I've said this before, but the best, fastest and most enjoyable of learning is to play with other people. There are a ton of guys your age who are just getting into music now and I believe that certain stores organize 'band camp' weekends to help you meet one another.


Necks: I love the #1 neck, it's damn near perfect. The next guitar I order will have the #1d (V-shape, 12"), just to try it out. I really like a V-neck, the reduced shoulder bulk but increased depth makes the neck sit nicer in my hand.

Great start!

[sam]

Hey Alf great start and thanks for taking the nod, you will see it's a lot of fun.

G&L QUESTION

What is it about G&Ls that make them so special to you?
So many things can be put here. Yes, first it was the #2 neck that got me, and yet now I think the #1 offers different playing feel and capability. Those big 'ol MFD's and the stealth z-coils are some sweet p-ups that I would put against anybody. Last but not least the build quality is consistently very good. There may have been a hiccup or two over the years but I have bought all sight unseen and have yet to return one.

Followup and just curious, do you think G&L should do a compound radius neck?
Don't really know about that one, will have to think it over. (good question)

NON G&L QUESTION (is about passion)

I assume that if I had played guitar for a very long time and was pretty good at it, I would feel the same way. Is that the case?
IMHO the more you spend doing something the better you get, but with musical instruments the way you practice contributes as much as the time spent. Stretch yourself in preactice and then you see progress.

As far as passion, road cycling is where my time is also spent. (Just watch the replay of this weeks Tour of Oman on Versus!) With spring in the air the wheels will be rolling soon!!

[cmguitar]

Alf,
As far as G&L go I have 2 A 90's Legacy wired like a S500 that I thank is cool, and a ASAT III. I also own MIJ Tokai and Fernandes Strats and a Corona Strat.
I go for G&L for quality Fender is hit and miss as far as quality goes . Mine is good IMO.
Quality is a big factor but overall feel is what I look for in a guitar. Name is moot as far as I am concerned. I have makes I look for over others. I won't buy anymore Gibson products. (At least built by the present Gibson company)
One of the original G&L dealers here quit selling them I don't know why. As large a D/FW now is we only have 3 G&L dealers!
Its just like the business I am in you got to sell what has the most appeal or you will go out of business. Not that the product is any better.
I started playing as a pre teen I quit in my early 20s I picked it back up in 96 when I was 35. I am 49 now.
I have the passion I don't have the self confidence. I have forgotten more than I now remember I have considered taking a lesson or two to get a different prospective. My main playing buddy got transferred. So I right now don't have a different view of my playing.
I was a better player at 20 than I am at almost 50. I think I can work it out, but I will never be as good as I used to be.
I also went through a phase where if I didn't get the sound i liked ect... I would buy another guitar. I got up to 13 at one time. It wasn't the guitar it was the player. I got 8 guitars now I should get rid of more. I can only play 1 at a time. I finally got off my butt and started practicing more.
I guess what I am getting at is learning and keeping your playing skills can be frustrating but it can pay off even if it for your own enjoyment.
You have passion or you wouldn't be questioning yourself.


Chet

[sickbutnottired]

Welcome! I love your questions... I am a skier as well, however, I didn't start skiing seriously until I went to college.

G&L There is no one thing about G&L's for me. I love the MFD's, but I love my deluxe with Seymores, too. I love my pencil thin f-100 neck, but also my chunkier bbe eras. So to me it's their consistent attention to detail and build quality. Good designs, executed well.

I also appreciate some of their common sense, maybe player centric business practices. Letting you buy a replacement neck comes to mind.

Passion Passion is an interesting thing. It can come and go, be positive and negative. Music, and guitar particularly, is one of my enduring passions. I think that it is similar to skiing, that as you get better you enjoy it more. For one thing, as you get some playing skills together it gives you more variety to work on. For me, even though i love to play, I have to set goals or else I don't push myself, then I get frustrated with my lack of progress. Right now I am working with a group to get a set of originals together for a May art house gig. Fun stuff, and it feeds the passion, feeds the beast.

Besides music I am passionate about building things. I like to physically build things, and music is actually kinda similar.

[astutzmann]

Thanks everyone for the wonderful replies, great stuff. I liked them all!

No skiing today, rained out. But still had soup and salad, ha!

Interesting last comment about building things and that being like music. I too like to build things, built this for my Guitar Teacher and delivered on saturday, his wife is due this week with their second.

[darwinohm]

Alf, good questions and off to a great start.

I like all of my guitars. My last G&L showed up a couple of weeks ago. Last week I happened to bond with a Fender Tele. and that came home with me. I especially like the body and neck woods that G&L uses. They are some of the most beautiful guitars on the planet for the money. I got my first one about three years ago and now have 11 (i think) and may have more in the future. In addition to what I've already mentioned, the quality is outstanding. I am a techie and retired so guitars are my passion along with music. I have been a bassist most of my life and have become moderately proficient on guitar in the last 5 years. I find that I plateau for a while and all of a sudden, things that were difficult become easier. it sneaks up on you and all of a sudden you are there and ready for the next climb. I am fortunate to be able to study under an extremely talented lead guitarist. At our gig yesterday there were many musicians. The lead players like to stand around and watch him. Now that I am retired, I like to practice an hour or two every morning. I do this while watching TV and sitting with the Kitties. Over and over makes for perfection and I try to add a new one every week or so.

My Grand Daughters are really into skiing both won first place in their age groups for the state this last weekend. Hope they can keep it up!-- Darwin

[yowhatsshakin]

Interesting last comment about building things and that being like music. I too like to build things, built this for my Guitar Teacher and delivered on saturday, his wife is due this week with their second.

Hi Alf,
Fixed up the image tag so everybody can see the picture. When logged in to your Apple .me account, copy the link to the left of the 'gear' icon in your upper right corner when you have a picture displayed. You just need to add either web.jpg or medium .jpg depending on how big you want to have it shown. Using 'https' in your image tag is not going to work.

- Jos

[astutzmann]

thx for that, I'll get it right, sometime, lol

[Boogie Bill]

My very first pro music job was working at Alpental, a ski area up on Snoqualmie Pass, an hour east of Seattle in the Cascade Mountains. I worked there for two winters, and had a blast. I started in December, 1971; I had just turned 21. Had a free ski pass each season, but never learned to ski. I have a VERY wide foot, and it was just impossible to find boots. Lots of good stories, lots of good memories.

I don't know if it is worth re-tooling for a compound radius neck. It seems like a great idea, but I'm not sure it really pays off. My Les Paul Elegant has a compound radius fingerboard of ebony, with abalone inlays; but it plays pretty much like the other LPs.

I love the G&L necks! I knew about G&L from the very beginning. I have two of Leo's pre-G&L Music Man Sabre IIs. They have the 7.25" radius and vintage frets, which was great for the rhythm work I was doing back in the day. One has been refretted with larger frets. Both are very slim necks.

I also had a 1960 Strat that I sold in 1991. When I went looking for another Strat, the salesman showed me a new Legacy. The neck profile was basically the same as the 1960 Strat, but with the 12" radiused board. Took about 22.7 seconds to realize the possibilities, and I was hooked.

Most of my G&Ls have the same profile, and it's Baby Bear perfect--just right. Two of the older guitars have the "stupid slim" necks, fine by me, as I have small hands. My two Comanches and my Butterscotch Blonde Legacy Special are 2000-01 vintage, have the same overall profile--just fuller. One guitar has a neck that is just slightly different; but the Vintage White Legacy, also post-2000, has a neck from Mars. Not my favorite neck--it is very different--doesn't even feel like the same company. This is the weirdest feeling neck of all the guitars I own, and the only one that takes me any real time to adjust to. If I could get a new neck for this guitar, I would, in heartbeat.

Music and guitaring are really my only passion. I have a lot of guitars, but a relatively dull and boring life. I live to gig!

Good start to the LR.

Bill

[cmguitar]

Bill,
I guess it is taste but my G&L's are 3 bolt neck the Legacy has a 12" radius the ASAT III 9 1/2" radius I think.
The over all feel of older G&L's have a diffrent feel over the newer 4 bolt neck models. To me the newer G&L's feel like good quality Fender .
IMO. If i want a Fender I will buy a Fender. If i want a G&L I will buy a G&L. Not a G&L that feels like a Fender.

Chet

[Jaystrings]

Welcome. It's ALL about the necks, to me. I'd never heard of G&L about 10 years ago, but one neck fondle convinced me that this brand was worth a closer look. The convincer for me was spending the biggest part of a day at Buffalo Brothers while on vacation. I was surrounded by a roomful of beautiful new and used guitars, mostly G&Ls. There was not one electric in that shop that felt as good as the G&L line, and the entire line had great necks. Just something about the overall comfort, it just felt "right". For years I'd tried to pull the trigger on a nice Gretsch or Gibson, but the necks always kept me from going that far - even though I liked everything else about the guitars.

Isn't it weird that before Darth's Boyz got their CNC machine, no 2 necks ever seemed alike - but they were all good, I must say. There are a couple in my harem that have unbelievable necks: my ASAT Trinity, my Spalted Maple Legacy, my '86 ASAT, and my ole SC-2. I also have an ASAT Classic that is likely to be a keeper just like those mentioned. Same reason, too.

Great start.

Jay

[Dr B]

Great post Alf and welcome

I'm a newbie here and have only been playing for a short while. I have played a number of G&Ls in the shops (which got me hooked). As a beginner, I could not justify paying for a USA one at that time - so I got a Tribute Asat Classic - which is great. The necks on the Tributes are different to the USA models.

Dont get me wrong, my Asat is really nice to play and has a great neck on it - but the USA Asat and the Legacy that I have also tried in the shop is in another league. I have just invested in a spalted maple legacy from the USA and it will be shipped later this month. I am looking forward to it.

For me, I am not too sure radius is the main issue with necks, its more about the shape at the back of the neck for me. My Asat has a 9.5'' radius and the incoming Legacy at 12'' - but the actual shape of the neck and the amount of meat on it (or not as the case may be) affects the feel more for me.

I was in the shop at the weekend and tried a Dave Glimour sig series Fender alongside the Eric Clapton sig series Fender. Both are very nice as you would expect from the custom shop - but i was very dissapointed with the Gilmour strat neck. It was thinner than I expected (I think it was a 7.5'' as well - but not sure) and I simply could not get to like it. The Clapton one had a nice soft V shape at headstock end and the neck felt much more meatier and more comfortable for me. Both had vintage frets (or at least ones that were noticably smaller than many other guitars in the shop and my G&L). The Clapton was 9.5''. I would be stunned if the reason i preferred the Clapton model was simply down to the difference between 7.5 and 9.5. I became convinced that, irrespective of the soft v, the necks are completely different at the back as well (different shapes and / or different amounts of wood) - even if Fender dont tell you that this is the case.

Anyway, its all academic really as none of them felt better than the G&Ls I've played - including my Tribute!