I'm coming out of the closet about Richie Sambora!!!!

[Dr B]

OK - not quite - but I just wanted to say a few words words about a guilty pleasure I indulge. While not being a strong Bon Jovi fan by any means, I really enjoy the guitar playing of Sambora. To me he can do all the necessary tricks of the modern rock guitarist (fast legato, sweep picks, tapping, etc), but remains inherently a rock-blues man. His solos are typically tastful and never over-done or more than the song needs - so he is a good song writer and uses the guitar to support the song and not over-dominate it.

I cannot think of a poor solo, or a riff that fails to work for him. OK, BJ are a little formulaic but that does not mean it does not work. I dont think he gets the acknolwedgement he should as a guitarist because people think he is in a big-haired 1980s girly rock band....but i would urge all of you to listen again...

Any guilty guitar pleasures (nothing too rude!!!!) out there?

[sirmyghin]

. I dont think he gets the acknolwedgement he should as a guitarist because people think he is in a big-haired 1980s girly rock band....but i would urge all of you to listen again...

Bon Jovi isn't a big haired 1980s girly rock band?


Just playing with you, and I will one up you. Neal Schon of Journey is a ridiculously awesome player... (goes and hides in shame).

[blargfromouterspace]

Yep, sirmy is right - Bon Jovi are a girly rock rock band Sambora is a good guitarist, not my sort of thing, but a good guitarist nonetheless. His signature strat was pretty cool with stars for fret markers.



Neal Schon is also a fine guitarist, though a Les Paul with a Floyd Rose on it is wrong on soooooo many levels. I enjoy Journey's music, since before that crap, auto-tuned show 'Glee' came out.



I can't think of a guitarist I should be ashamed of liking, but I do enjoy the '80s and '90s material of.......


Michael Bolton


I have probably just lost any respect you guys may have had for me...... But I think his music, though cheesier than an explosion in a Stilton factory, is a perfect example of pop music from that period. He also has a damn fine voice and can still sing the songs he was singing 30 years ago just as well today, and you can't say that about everyone.

[Aussie]

Neal Schon is also a fine guitarist, though a Les Paul with a Floyd Rose on it is wrong on soooooo many levels.

LOL - Have to agree. But how about Schon with a dual fulcrum then ....



Cheers, Robbie

[yowhatsshakin]

I can't think of a guitarist I should be ashamed of liking, but I do enjoy the '80s and '90s material of.......


Michael Bolton

Michael Bolton !!?? WTH

Just kidding! The man has pipes. And hair ...

- Jos

[sirmyghin]

Neal Schon is also a fine guitarist, though a Les Paul with a Floyd Rose on it is wrong on soooooo many levels. .

Alex Lifeson would like to have a word with you (I love floyds).

[blargfromouterspace]

Alex Lifeson would like to have a word with you (I love floyds).

Good! There's a few things I'd like to ask Mr. Lifeson - I have some broken kitchen appliances I need to get rid of, perhaps Rush could use them as props (note the washing machines behind the band...)

[Philby]

Kurt Cobain and I have something in common. No, not heroin use. Or gun ownership. Kurt and I both like ABBA. Kurt was much more forthcoming in acknowledging it though.....

When I was younger it was all about the well endowed young Swedish ladies wearing tight fitting glam outfits.

But now I'm older I can appreciate that much of their material, particularly the late stuff, was musically very complex while being tuneful, meticulously arranged and expertly played/sung. The production techniques were also fairly advanced for the period. And Frida has a voice which is like red velvet on my eardrums after hearing the current auto-tuned pop starlets.

This one is one of my fave Abba songs. Bad 80's video though!

[youtube]tUh4u-lYEhM[/youtube]

[sirmyghin]

Alex Lifeson would like to have a word with you (I love floyds).

Good! There's a few things I'd like to ask Mr. Lifeson - I have some broken kitchen appliances I need to get rid of, perhaps Rush could use them as props (note the washing machines behind the band...)

So far I have seen the washing machines (R30), The rotissery chicken machine (S&A) and the really weird super sausauge machine (Time Machine Tour)

The stage props are Geddy's by the way, due to the lack of on stage amplification typically.

[sickbutnottired]

Oh the guilty pleasure songs. There are tons of people I respect as players, but don't really dig on the tunes. Just taste, you know. All these guys you all have mentioned are good players, in my opinion. The annoying ones are the players that aren't much and I STILL like the song--Head East anyone? I never miss a chance to hear 'going down for the last time.'

Especially in the privacy of my own room room, on headphones, with all the lights out so no one can bust me.

Edit: The name of the song, according to google is 'Never Been Any Reason', would hate to have my fan club membership revoked.

jeremy

[Dr B]

Great discussion

With Sambora - I just think he is the perfect all round band guitarist - making it fit with the song. Slash is great, but he and Axl could not make it work and in the words of Ozzy - "They blew it when they split". Sambora and Bon Jovi stuck at it and have made it work, not too dissimilar to the stones perhaps (at least in principle).

Its odd that many great guitarists cannot settle in one band - including two of my heroes (Clapton / Peter Green). There seems to be a whole lead guitar vs lead singer thing going on

Although the 1990s was generally a terrible time for rock guitar with lots of drivel around anyone remember Europe )- there were some gems in there as well.

[Dr B]

Oh...forgot to mention...over the last 4 years or so I have seen live, Clapton, Santana, and Bon Jovi and what you see are musicians at the top of their game (whether you are a fan or not - you cannot deny the talent and ability). Its wonderful simply watching artists enjoying what they do and being good at what they do.

at times it makes me want to put the guitar down (as I will never be able to be that good) but then, it also insipres me to try to nail some of the ideas.

[sirmyghin]

^^

The problem with the guitarists you list is they have little sense of adventure (at least anymore). They have never really done anything different, gone against the norm or attributed anything spectacular. They are merely good players, set in a framework they are comfortable, which gives the appearance of being limitless on stage. The same could be said for Iron Maiden (whom I saw last summer) flawless performance, and excellent playing, but Iron Maiden is pretty linear (not that they didn't go against the vein, seeing as they are a heavy metal act and the worlds largest at that). Same idea though.

The other Artists I saw were Rush and Satriani, bands with constantly changing sounds, progressive motives and a sound they can call original. Kind of a different ball game then, that is when the real musicians come out to play in my books.

A great guitarist that is overlooked is Steve Stevens however, he could play the pants off a lot of folks. His punk attitude and girlish good looks ( ) aside.

[Dr B]

I have to say I disagree about those artists not being original, or not being original anymore. I agree Sambora follows a formula (riff, pre chorus, chorus, repeat, fade to end) - but he actually is more musical than most guitarists of his type.

Peter Green is a shadow of his former self (but still playing) - but has had mental health problems - so I think its fair to say he will not be reinventing the wheel anytime soon - but just look at what he did when he was at the top of his game.

People often say Clapton has not 'done anything' new recently. These are often people that dont see him live across his many different collaborations. His playing is straight pentatonic / blues scale (99% of the time) - but so what? Its all about feel for blues players and few really have it. Clapton does. To my ear he is one of the most authentic electric blues players out there. But yes, no technical player by any stretch. But then, neither is Gilmour. But both Clapton and Gilmour were genre setting musicians and can still pull it out of the bag live.

Clapton is different everytime I see him - constantly reinterpreting his stuff. If every album were like the Cream, people would just say he has not moved on so I guess he cannot win

Satriani and Vai etc, great technicians no doubt about that

[sirmyghin]

I have to say I disagree about those artists not being original, or not being original anymore. I agree Sambora follows a formula (riff, pre chorus, chorus, repeat, fade to end) - but he actually is more musical than most guitarists of his type.

Peter Green is a shadow of his former self (but still playing) - but has had mental health problems - so I think its fair to say he will not be reinventing the wheel anytime soon - but just look at what he did when he was at the top of his game.

People often say Clapton has not 'done anything' new recently. These are often people that dont see him live across his many different collaborations. His playing is straight pentatonic / blues scale (99% of the time) - but so what? Its all about feel for blues players and few really have it. Clapton does. To my ear he is one of the most authentic electric blues players out there. But yes, no technical player by any stretch. But then, neither is Gilmour. But both Clapton and Gilmour were genre setting musicians and can still pull it out of the bag live.

Clapton is different everytime I see him - constantly reinterpreting his stuff. If every album were like the Cream, people would just say he has not moved on so I guess he cannot win

Satriani and Vai etc, great technicians no doubt about that

I found the problem , all accounts told it sounds like you are a blues guitarist. This causes you to believe playing the blues has some some kind of soulful transcension to playing . I could leave the blues 30 years gone (which is where it is regardless) and more from there. Vai I would say composes some of the most beautiful pieces this century has to offer, sure he can let er rip at times but it seldom detracts from the atmosphere. Blues tends to have guitar solos for the sake of guitar solos (and the worst lyrics and the constant call and response is a drag), where as the quality of music is in the soundscape, which Blues doesn't really go through much trouble to cultivate, it is too, samish.. More a background to play one sound specifically than anything revolutionary after it left the Delta.

I wouldn't of wanted Clapton to sound like Cream, except in the sense where Cream was a fair bit progressive, which is always the right direction.

[blargfromouterspace]

I found the problem , all accounts told it sounds like you are a blues guitarist. This causes you to believe playing the blues has some some kind of soulful transcension to playing . I could leave the blues 30 years gone (which is where it is regardless) and more from there.

Blues tends to have guitar solos for the sake of guitar solos (and the worst lyrics and the constant call and response is a drag),

Sirmy: I'm looking forward to the day when you find a Blues guy you enjoy. There's no use trying to deny it either. One day you'll hear someone and have an "Ah-Ha!" moment. Please let me know when this happens.

I wont go into Vai, we've been there before

[Dr B]

I found the problem , all accounts told it sounds like you are a blues guitarist. This causes you to believe playing the blues has some some kind of soulful transcension to playing .

I've never made any secret of being into the blues - but to think this does not cover a myriad of interpretations (from Hendrix, SRV / Clapton, etc) is to not understand the music, or more importantly, the phrasing of it.

Dont take my word for it, Clapton has been inducted into the RocknRoll hall of fame three times. Nuff said.

The problem for Vai, Satriani, Malmsteen and their ilk is that at times - its just fretboard vomit. However, I do prefer Vai of all those players as he does have more melody to him. Anyway, these things are subjective - so I guess we will not agree so lets just be thankful we have our influences.

However, i would point out, as i did in earlier posts, that most of the people that talk nonsense about clapton and players like him are those that dont go and see these guys live. Most artists are completely different live.

[sirmyghin]

. Most artists are completely different live.

Fair enough, a lot of guys really 'open up' live. The 'technicians' are no exception, I feel they have more difficulty distilling the song to an album track, live the tunes are very, very different. Speaking of which Vai is supposed to tour this year, I need to see that.

Knopfler probably has some of the more extreme differences live I have encouterred in rock music though. Love his playing too.

[asphalt-abate]

COOL!!!!

This is like the old days on the old old forum.

Great post Dr. B.

Keep shakin' it up.

[sickbutnottired]

The problem for Vai, Satriani, Malmsteen and their ilk is that at times - its just fretboard vomit. However, I do prefer Vai of all those players as he does have more melody to him. Anyway, these things are subjective - so I guess we will not agree so lets just be thankful we have our influences.

However, i would point out, as i did in earlier posts, that most of the people that talk nonsense about clapton and players like him are those that dont go and see these guys live. Most artists are completely different live.

Fretboard vomit, I have not heard that. Cracks me up. I wore my Passion and Warfare tape out in middle school, probably one of the reasons I got serious about learning guitar! Live music and recorded music are totally different animals to me. It also seems that the best can carry off both in every genre, though--must be be nice to be amazingly talented. I have seen Clapton twice, and loved both his shows. He is a very expressive player.

On the recorded side, did you happen to take in his collaboration with jj cale a few years back, 'The Road to Escondido'. Very folk, I loved it.

I feel they have more difficulty distilling the song to an album track, live the tunes are very, very different. Speaking of which Vai is supposed to tour this year, I need to see that.

I agree 100% that these guys have a heck of a time distilling anything to an album, album track--or even a song for that matter. I just kinda chalk to up to a lack of musical ability covered by constantly shouting 'look what I can do with this guitar!!!'

I would kinda like to see Vai, though. I saw Black Label Society a few years back, and really enjoyed it. I think of Vai as more musical type of guy than Zakk Wylde (can't remember how to spell Zack or Wild.)

I guess at the end of the day I am just a music lover and pretty much go for most anything. There are a lot of crappy blues out there, same as every other form of art I have ever come across.

[Dr B]

Influence comes in many forms and its great that we are all lucky enough to have our influences.

I would like to see Vai without the effects. Unplugged so to speak - as the guy can most certainly play. He is a master of the modern rock guitar - but occassionally i feel he, and others like Malmsteen, become predictable and often keep trying to ram their 'guitar CV' down everyone's throat by showing us, in every solo, all their tricks and licks. This to me means the musician is no longer supporting the music and song.

I often look at the solos and think "did you really need to do all that sweep picking right there at that point in time? Is that the most tasteful selection of notes for that part of the composition?" When I ask this question of Beck, Gilmour, Clapton, Green, Frampton, etc, the answer is invariably - yes. But i dont 'feel' it for many others (subjective I know....).

I often think some guitarists would be better musicians if they knew less or had a more limited vocabulary (and odd thing to say i know) as tricks and licks distract from musicality at times.

[sirmyghin]

You about summed up why I can't listen to players like BB king. Too predictable, always the same. I know what you mean about solos often though. It is a lot worse on the records than live though. I try to avoid solos personally, if I can help it. My currently in pre-production piece (written not recorded) has some tasty licks, syncopation and chops, but nothing I would call a solo. The problem was it builds momentum as it goes, so I had to preserve that in all aspects. The bass is a bloody treat.

[CGT]

@sirmyghin I feel the same way about Mark Knopfler, especially live. His playing on the road now consists of stringing together sequences of signature riffs, much to the delight of crowds everywhere. Sadly, he lost me on Dire Straits' 1992 On Every Street tour, during which his playing was already a shadow of his frenetic live style circa the 1985 Brothers in Arms tour (one of the best shows I've ever seen).

I tried again about four years ago, and took in one of his solo shows. Same thing. Stringing together predictable riffs. Same cheering crowd. Gotta wonder if I hear things differently since I started playing again.