NGD ASAT III

[art]

I've been curious about ASAT IIIs, but I really wasn't planning on buying one. Right, we all know how these things go. I'd seen this guitar listed before, but didn't notice that it was local. I recently noticed that, and I was able to check it out before buying, at that point I couldn't resist (it's not a rarebird, but still).

Oddly, this guitar has two serial numbers, CLF13393 on the back of the headstock and G046028 on the neck plate. Someone entered this guitar in the registry with the note that it was a custom build for Paul Arron who worked at G&L from 1987 to 2002. The body is stamped Dec 12th, 1995. And, sure enough (or maybe coincidentally) the neck has four markings on it: in pencil, "neck work" with a signature and "99", "Paul" in red ink, and "Tint Shiny BE CC" in blue ballpoint maybe, and "pay GS neck only"(?) in black. So that's kind of cool, I approached the instrument with the thought that it might be a parts-SAT masquerading as the real thing. Also, it was listed in the registry as a one-off design, but I think it's an early 2nd gen ASAT III.

Photos just don't do the bird'e eye maple justice, and cherryburst has never been a favorite finish, but with a tortoise guard, imho, it looks pretty sexy. Shows very little wear, looks like it spent most of its life in a case. Great sounding pickups, each of the five positions has a distinct sound, definitely some quack on tap. The controls feel very responsive, I love the PTB system, but the simplicity of a single tone control is nice. I'm not sure how to identify the neck exactly, I like it, whatever it is. I'm also wondering what the dot markers on the neck are made of, they almost have a tortoise like coloring (doesn't show up too well in the photos).

And where would we be with no photos...

Cheers,
art

[sam]

Hey Art,

Congratulations sounds like a cool history on that ASAT III. Having it local sure made the difference.

Here is a helpful link Craig put together with posting picture information.

Tutorial: Posting photos http://guitarsbyleo.com/FORUM/viewtopic ... 36&t=10450

Look forward to seeing those pics!

[art]

Hey Art,

Congratulations sounds like a cool history on that ASAT III. Having it local sure made the difference.

Here is a helpful link Craig put together with posting picture information.

Tutorial: Posting photos http://guitarsbyleo.com/FORUM/viewtopic ... 36&t=10450

Look forward to seeing those pics!

Hey Sam, thanks, not sure what I did wrong. I'll try something else with the photos, it's weird because I can see the photos in my post...

Ok, I *think* I got it now, I can see the photos in my post whether I'm logged into the board or not.

Thanks again, Sam. Oh, and, nice roses!
art

[Craig]

Hey Art,

Congratulations sounds like a cool history on that ASAT III. Having it local sure made the difference.

Here is a helpful link Craig put together with posting picture information.

Tutorial: Posting photos http://guitarsbyleo.com/FORUM/viewtopic ... 36&t=10450

Look forward to seeing those pics!

Hey Sam, thanks, not sure what I did wrong. I'll try something else with the photos, it's weird because I can see the photos in my post...

Ok, I *think* I got it now, I can see the photos in my post whether I'm logged into the board or not.

Thanks again, Sam. Oh, and, nice roses!
art

They are showing now, so you must have changed the share permissions.

Thanks for posting this, as this explains the registry entries in our G&L Registry.
I sent your post to one of my contacts at the factory to see if he can get the log histories of both of those serial numbers.
I will post a follow up once I hear back from him.

Stay tuned.

[art]

They are showing now, so you must have changed the share permissions.

Thanks for posting this, as this explains the registry entries in our G&L Registry.
I sent your post to one of my contacts at the factory to see if he can get the log histories of both of those serial numbers.
I will post a follow up once I hear back from him.

Stay tuned.

Hey Craig, thanks, that's exactly what I had to do. And also, thanks for asking about the log entries for this beauty!

Cheers,
art

[sam]

Art, you are right on, that is one beautiful neck! great looker all around.

[FZTNT]

Sweet III...I have one and I love it but it is for sale. Love that Birds Eye neck. I'm not sure but I think those dot markers are a dark form of Mother Of Pearl. I have a legacy and If I remember right the build sheet says MOP markers and the neck looks just like tours including the BEM.



Tom

[yowhatsshakin]

Looks like a gorgeous replacement neck to me, which like had a serial number under the lacquer already. From the holes in the neck you can see it was never used for a 4-bolt attachment. Another interesting thing is the diver at the bottom. For a trie 3-bolt neck there would have been a small metallic plate there the set screw ould much against.




Since that plate is not there, the set screw now just creates a divot when the bolts are tightened.

- Jos

[Craig]

I heard back from Spencer:

Hi Craig,

I looked into this a bit and unfortunately the neck plate serial number is in a gap between records that we have.
The number puts it right around late 1995, which would be consistent with the body stamp.

The neck is a replacement. The serial places it in 1999. All the markings on the back are consistent with that.
The “CC” is actually “CL” which was used as the shorthand for ASAT Classic at the time. “Tint Shiny” was used
for the Glossy Gun oil Tint at the time. “BE” for Birds-eye maple. “Neck only” to designate it as a replacement neck.
Only thing I’m not sure on is the “pay GS” which might be 65 to indicate what they were charging for it? That’s a total guess though.

On the Paul Arron, a couple of the guys here remember the name. I started in 1999 and don’t remember him, but he could have still
been here. But I can’t confirm his dates on when he worked here. It was very likely an employee build, and either put together by him
as a “parts-SAT” or purchased as a regular ASAT III and needing a neck replacement later.

For your logs I would put it in under the neck plate serial number as an ASAT III for 1995 with a neck replaced later.

That’s all I could find on this unfortunately. Hope that helps though.

Thanks,

Spencer

Hope this helps.

I will be updating the two registry entries per Spencer's recommendation.

[art]

Looks like a gorgeous replacement neck to me, which like had a serial number under the lacquer already. From the holes in the neck you can see it was never used for a 4-bolt attachment. Another interesting thing is the diver at the bottom. For a trie 3-bolt neck there would have been a small metallic plate there the set screw ould much against.


Since that plate is not there, the set screw now just creates a divot when the bolts are tightened.

- Jos

Thanks Jos, I had intended to ask about that, my '83 SC-2 has the plate, I was wondering why it was missing on this neck. It's not only gorgeous, it feels awesome. One thing is that the edges are a little more rounded than my newer G&Ls (at least, I think).
art

[art]

I heard back from Spencer:

...

Hope this helps.

I will be updating the two registry entries per Spencer's recommendation.

Thanks Craig! It's great to piece together a little of the history of an instrument (maybe, anyway). '95 ASAT III it is, nice

I've always admired gun oil tinting, but I didn't recognize it when I met it in person. Looks even nicer in person!

Thanks again Craig,
art

[FZTNT]

Looks like a gorgeous replacement neck to me, which like had a serial number under the lacquer already. From the holes in the neck you can see it was never used for a 4-bolt attachment. Another interesting thing is the diver at the bottom. For a trie 3-bolt neck there would have been a small metallic plate there the set screw ould much against.




Since that plate is not there, the set screw now just creates a divot when the bolts are tightened.

- Jos

Nice catch Jos. So, it's a three bolt setup but with no way to perform the micro-tilt adjustment? Shouldn't the factory have taken care of that when they replaced the neck? I would imagine it's as strong a joint as any other three bolt joint, you would just need to use shims to make the tilt adjustment. I would be bummed out cause I love the micro-tilt concept. Maybe that's why I tend to lead towards the older G&Ls.

Tom

[FZTNT]

Sweet III...I have one and I love it but it is for sale. Love that Birds Eye neck. I'm not sure but I think those dot markers are a dark form of Mother Of Pearl. I have a legacy and If I remember right the build sheet says MOP markers and the neck looks just like tours including the BEM.



Tom

Ya know, the more I look at the two necks and look at other guitars and spec sheets, I change my mind. I believe what you have is Abalone dots on that beautiful neck. Very similar to MOP but a bit darker.

Tom

[yowhatsshakin]

Nice catch Jos. So, it's a three bolt setup but with no way to perform the micro-tilt adjustment? Shouldn't the factory have taken care of that when they replaced the neck? I would imagine it's as strong a joint as any other three bolt joint, you would just need to use shims to make the tilt adjustment. I would be bummed out cause I love the micro-tilt concept. Maybe that's why I tend to lead towards the older G&Ls.

Tom

Tom,

Yes, unfortunately the micro-tilt has been rendered useless. And I agree that should have been taken care of. After all, 1999 is a mere 2 years removed from when they made the transition to 4-bolt neck attachments. And I bet there would have been a couple of these disk inserts in the surplus bin somewhere in the factory.

But then again, if it is no longer top of mind because you are now so used to doing it differently, it is really easy to overlook.

- Jos

[yowhatsshakin]

Looks like a gorgeous replacement neck to me, which like had a serial number under the lacquer already. From the holes in the neck you can see it was never used for a 4-bolt attachment. Another interesting thing is the diver at the bottom. For a trie 3-bolt neck there would have been a small metallic plate there the set screw ould much against.


Since that plate is not there, the set screw now just creates a divot when the bolts are tightened.

- Jos

Thanks Jos, I had intended to ask about that, my '83 SC-2 has the plate, I was wondering why it was missing on this neck. It's not only gorgeous, it feels awesome. One thing is that the edges are a little more rounded than my newer G&Ls (at least, I think).
art

Hey Art,

An idea that came just to me as a kind of poor man's solution to the absence of the micro-tilt functionality: That indent is the exact location of the pointy end of the set screw. So if you were to take the neck off, you could put a tapered flat head wood screw in that location of the neck heel, forcing the set screw to push against a piece of metal instead. You would have to make sure the screw is enough countersunk such that its flat top is flush with the surface. And of course, you still would have to reset the neck angle after this operation. Since I trust they paid attention to neck angle in the factory when they replaced the neck, this might just be to back out the set screw until nothing stick out anymore, only then reattach the neck, and then gently tighten the set screw until you feel resistance. But it would reenable the micro-tilt mechanism.

- Jos

[Craig]

Nice catch Jos. So, it's a three bolt setup but with no way to perform the micro-tilt adjustment? Shouldn't the factory have taken care of that when they replaced the neck? I would imagine it's as strong a joint as any other three bolt joint, you would just need to use shims to make the tilt adjustment. I would be bummed out cause I love the micro-tilt concept. Maybe that's why I tend to lead towards the older G&Ls.

Tom

Tom,

Yes, unfortunately the micro-tilt has been rendered useless. And I agree that should have been taken care of. After all, 1999 is a mere 2 years removed from when they made the transition to 4-bolt neck attachments. And I bet there would have been a couple of these disk inserts in the surplus bin somewhere in the factory.

But then again, if it is no longer top of mind because you are now so used to doing it differently, it is really easy to overlook.

- Jos

Guys,

You seem to be overlooking that this was an "employee built" guitar and the replacement neck was not for a customer guitar.
The replacement neck was likely chosen by the employee found at the factory and possibly one which was partially built and not used.
Dean and I have seen necks like this at the factory and Dean has gotten a few like that in the past. This was a neck which was originally
built for an "ASAT Classic" per the model decal on the headstock and already had a serial number installed, so it was intended to be used
for a 4-bolt ASAT Classic body. The proper decal for an ASAT III neck would have had the "ASAT" decal.
The factory would not put a replacement neck on a customer guitar with the wrong model name decal and a CLF serial numbered neck, for a 3-bolt body
with a serialized 3-bolt neck plate. I would guess that the employee (Paul) was not interested in having the micro-tilt installed on his replacement neck.

My $0.02.

[FZTNT]

You seem to be overlooking that this was an "employee built" guitar and the replacement neck was not for a customer guitar.
The replacement neck was likely chosen by the employee found at the factory and possibly one which was partially built and not used.
Dean and I have seen necks like this at the factory and Dean has gotten a few like that in the past. This was a neck which was originally
built for an "ASAT Classic" per the model decal on the headstock and already had a serial number installed, so it was intended to be used
for a 4-bolt ASAT Classic body. The proper decal for an ASAT III neck would have had the "ASAT" decal.
The factory would not put a replacement neck on a customer guitar with the wrong model name decal and a CLF serial numbered neck, for a 3-bolt body
with a serialized 3-bolt neck plate. I would guess that the employee (Paul) was not interested in having the micro-tilt installed on his replacement neck.

My $0.02.

I suppose that makes sense. I still love the micro-tilt design.

Tom

[art]

Thanks everyone, I'm totally jazzed about this guitar.

Tom - I saw some references to black abalone dots, maybe that's what they are?
Jos - Thanks for the suggestion to fix the micro-tilt functionality, seems like a relatively easy fix.

Cheers,
art