SC3 'Deluxe?'

[Danley]

Figured I'd post this for an official 'debunk' : the Reverb seller of the guitar below claims it as an 'SC3 Deluxe.' That model was on price lists (apparently so far defined only as a few different color options and possible maple board,) but the seller claims it meant an extra knob (basically making it a Skyhawk) and relocated input to a side-jack. I believe the GGJaguars site points out that the differences between a 'Standard' and a 'Deluxe' are not clear/unknown.

Considering the obvious incorrect knobs and format/installation of the jack (sloppy and not like any other G&L,) I'm thinking this is BS. Any possibility the factory made 'Deluxes' this way?

[y2kc]

Danley,

SC3 Deluxes are very,very rare. The first batch all had 3 washers on the jack plate.

thanks for the heads up,

y2kc

[yowhatsshakin]

Hi Danley,

It is I who has claimed on his website the differences between the SC-3 and SC-3 Deluxe are unclear. Yes, they do appear as a separate entry on the January 1990 price list, as seen below. But from the entries it is not clear at all what the differences are. For the SB-series basses, the Deluxe was a version with a rosewood fingerboard. But for the SC-3, ebony, i.e. something different than maple, had been in use already since they appeared with matching painted neck and headstock. Hence my uncertainty of what the difference would be.


In short, it is not impossible the story is correct. Casey seems to know more about it than I do, at least when it comes down to the odd presence of only 3 washers on the output jack. However, having said all of that, the pickups are suspect unless "Deluxe" in this context means they are Alnico flat pole piece instead of Skyhawk MFDs. If so, this would be the first "SC-3 Deluxe" I have seen.

- Jos

P.S. Incidentally, adding the additional tone control would esthetically be a very similar mod as needed for the SB-2T where the additional master tone control on the existing control panel necessitates moving the outoput jack to the side.

[Danley]

SC3 Deluxes are very,very rare. The first batch all had 3 washers on the jack plate.

Can't tell if sarcasm

But for the SC-3, ebony, i.e. something different than maple, had been in use already since they appeared with matching painted neck and headstock. Hence my uncertainty of what the difference would be.

...

Alnico flat pole piece instead of Skyhawk MFDs. If so, this would be the first "SC-3 Deluxe" I have seen.

Didn't even notice the Alnico on first viewing, but did G&L use them on anything previous to the Legacy coming out (post-Leo?) As for the price list, looks like I found it below; it implies that *any* maple SC3 is technically a 'Deluxe' as no 'Standard' maple fretboard appears to be offered. Since all the maple board SC3s I've seen (pictures of) don't have three knobs despite being nominal Deluxes, that makes the 'aftermarket mod' story seem more likely to me.



Last hint now that I'm looking at it in broad daylight; you'd think they would use a Skyhawk pickguard if they knew the jack wouldn't be attached to it; the SC3 pickguard is reinforced differently (see screw placement) than the Skyhawk pickguard to prevent the jack from ripping out easily I assume. No reason for it if you relocate the jack:

[yowhatsshakin]

Yes, the first Legacy guitars from 1992 had Seymour Duncan SSL-2 pickups and are AFAIK the first Alnico pickups used on a G&L. But In one of the pictures you can decipher the S/N. And the entry for G023329 states they are Rio Grande pickups whereas the original pups should still be in the case. And yes, it is a 8-screw pickguard on the Skyhawk, much like a 1950's Stratocaster, versus the 10-screw pickguard seen on the SC-3. which is the correct SC-3 pickguard.

- Jos

[y2kc]

Sarcasm? Guilty as charged.

This is a third body style sc-3 that has had a knob added and a jack moved.
I am a Sc-3 fan and have more than my share. We have NOS sc-3's still in shipping boxes that are marked as Deluxe. This isn't one.


y2kc

[Craig]

Five years ago we had this discussion: sc3 with 3 knobs?.

After reviewing Greg's SC-3 pages and reviewing the July 1, 1990 Price List, I have come to the conclusion that the SC-3 "Deluxe" has
different wound MFD pickups (likely S-500 ones) from standard SC-3, which have Skyhawk MFD pickups.
The price lists says: "SC-3 -- DELUXE THREE SINGLE COIL PICKUPS, # 2 NECK"

Perhaps y2kc can check his SC-3 Deluxe's pickups (DC-R readings) to help verify my conclusion.

Also, I would like to see the headstock of the guitar in question.

[yowhatsshakin]

Sarcasm? Guilty as charged.

This is a third body style sc-3 that has had a knob added and a jack moved.
I am a Sc-3 fan and have more than my share. We have NOS sc-3's still in shipping boxes that are marked as Deluxe. This isn't one.


y2kc

Casey, what would make an SC-3 Deluxe "Deluxe"? It cannot be just the fingerboard because both SC-3 and SC-3 Deluxe could have rosewood board. I have always wondered ...

- Jos
P.S. In re Craig's remarks on pickups: The DC-R values for all S-500, Nighthawk, Skyhawk, and SC-3 guitars in my collection differ by no more than 1kΩ and fall coursely into 2 groups. Weird thing is that both groups have S-500, Skyhawk, and SC-3 guitars with these general values. So I still do not know with absolute certainty what to call what. Go figure ...

[Danley]

Five years ago we had this discussion: sc3 with 3 knobs?.

After reviewing Greg's SC-3 pages and reviewing the July 1, 1990 Price List, I have come to the conclusion that the SC-3 "Deluxe" has
different wound MFD pickups (likely S-500 ones) from standard SC-3, which have Skyhawk MFD pickups.
The price lists says: "SC-3 -- DELUXE THREE SINGLE COIL PICKUPS, # 2 NECK"

Perhaps y2kc can check his SC-3 Deluxe's pickups (DC-R readings) to help verify my conclusion.

Also, I would like to see the headstock of the guitar in question.

Looks normal:

[y2kc]

The "Deluxe" title really seems like an effort to make an old model new.
These are the last SC-3"s and they had plans to discontinue the model. Who doesn't want a "Deluxe" guitar?
That blue example on GG's site is a killer!

The change of pickups is possibly why these guitars are called "Deluxe". Again I feel that mostly marketing.

I find all three versions of this guitar very inviting to play. The weight, size and pure Leo tone make them a guitar that will not get put away.

If I have time today I will get out a guitar and see what I can see.

Take care,
y2kc

[y2kc]

Also these guitars do not have painted necks.=Deluxe? One has a sweet flamed neck that is truly "deluxe" in my book. I purchased these from Smith Music many years ago.

y2kc

[yowhatsshakin]

Also these guitars do not have painted necks.=Deluxe? One has a sweet flamed neck that is truly "deluxe" in my book. I purchased these from Smith Music many years ago.

y2kc

Thanks Casey!

This makes sense. They had the matching neck, matching headstock going at that time. With a bare neck, might be they needed better quality woods for esthetic reasons. This ould also make it understandable why the non-Deluxe only came with a rosewood board: you wouldn't want imperfections like knots to surface.

- Jos

[derick]

I own a '91 SC-3 with unpainted neck/headstock and rosewood board, the body was originally black. When I acquired it, the guitar was stripped and beat and and pretty hacked up. I refinished it in Viking Blue, but if it is/was a "Deluxe" then this color would have been incorrect? I didn't think my first refin attempt should be black, and I was right.

A $100 upcharge to get a non-painted neck seems high, if this was the only difference. The quality of the maple neck on mine is good, but not remarkable.





Sorry to backtrack, but your three "SC-3 Deluxe" guitars have MFD pickups? What was the difference between Skyhawk and S-500 pickups in the late Leo era?

[Danley]

Curious that yours doesn’t have a truss adjustment bullet - is it the later, recessed style or just missing?

[derick]

Curious that yours doesn’t have a truss adjustment bullet - is it the later, recessed style or just missing?

The bullet is in there, and works fine. Neck date is January 30, 1991, if that is after the change to the "later, recessed style."

[Danley]

Curious that yours doesn’t have a truss adjustment bullet - is it the later, recessed style or just missing?

The bullet is in there, and works fine. Neck date is January 30, 1991, if that is after the change to the "later, recessed style."

That's interesting - I didn't realize the newer style rod was ever used in SC3s (but a google search a moment ago allowed me to discover a few more.) Awesome guitar, I'd love to see pics of your refin; I also completed my first nitro refin last year (I did it in black against my judgment.) Mine ultimately came out fine - but I did wind up having to sand back basically my entire first attempt at color/clear at one point to re-do Was a great learning experience.

[derick]

My beat-to-snot SC-3 was acquired and refinned ten years ago, I paid around $340 for it as I recall. It's the only G&L I have that doesn't live in its case, because it doesn't have a case. It is close at hand, leaning against a bass cabinet in my office and gets banged around some.

I was disappointed in my nitro primer/Viking Blue paint job, and so dulled the finish with steel wool. Never did a clearcoat. I guess I've always considered the guitar something of a beater, and I do play it several times a week. Replaced the hacked up pickguard 10 years ago and the aftermarket knobs last year when the CLF Reseach project made them available again.

Still, it looks much better than when I got it.

[Danley]

Looks good - I think I’m more inclined to play guitars I don’t feel bad about scratching/denting. Sounds like that one should stay the way it is for you Reminds me of my Daphne Mustang.

[y2kc]

Looks great!

y2kc

[derick]

Thanks for the comments.

The question of what made a late SC-3 "Deluxe" still stands.

Is there any evidence that the pickups were different on the deluxe models?

It does make sense that sunburst wouldn't be offered with a body-color painted neck.

[derick]

Okay, a couple more data points.

ggjaguar states, on his Viking Blue May 1988 SC-3 page, that the "pickups were changed from Skyhawk units to S-500 units around 1990."
No mention of a deluxe SC-3 on the site, according to google.

George Fullerton, in his book Guitars from George and Leo states that, upon introduction the SC-3 had the same pickups as the Skyhawk which, at least by 1987 were the same as the "modern S-500." Also the same pickups were used in the ASAT-3 and first Interceptor. This information is on Pages 123, 117 and 120. So, if you wish to trust George Fullerton's memory in 2005, then the S-500 pickups were the same as Skyhawk pickups, at least by the time the S-500 got the Strat body.

Apologies if this has already been hashed out and nailed down.