New Member from Canada

Hello Everyone!

I picked up a 1997 SSS Legacy a couple of months back now as a project guitar. I began playing when I was 18 - my first guitar was a blonde 1977 Gibson Les Paul Deluxe I bought for $600 (at the time). I will forever regret selling that back in 92'. That was the year I married my wife, and bought a brand new Fender Sratocaster Deluxe (I still have it - in mint condition!). I've gone through a lot of guitars in the last 32 years, sticking exclusively to the higher end brands like Gibson and Fender. One day a few years back, I had something of an epiphany. A local pawn shop had a used, 2005 black 157CM Heritage guitar for sale. They were asking $1500 or so. I was in the shop looking for something else, and had a bit of time to kill, so I tried it out - expecting it to play like a cheap knock-off of a Gibson Les Paul. I didn't know that Heritage was a company started by former Gibson employees who stayed behind in Kalamazoo Michigan when Gibson moved its production to Nashville. These guys bought the old Gibson factory where they formerly made Gibson guitars, along with all the old machinery, and just kept on making quality guitars using the same skills, techniques, woods, and machinery as they had been using when making Gibson guitars. I mention that because it was something I wasn't aware of when I tried the guitar out - and I was shocked to find this "knock-off" was built better and sounded so much better than any Les Paul I had every owned or played. I eventually bought it, but what makes that story significant to this forum is that it marked the day I gave up on being a brand slave when it came to guitars.

I knew the Leo Fender story from the outset of G&L guitars. I always toyed with the idea of getting one, but never seemed able to talk myself into taking the plunge. The experience with the Heritage Les Paul however made me want to get a G&L more than ever.

So I began to keep my eye open for a used one, even as I squirreled money away in the event that I found one that I liked. That finally happened a couple of months ago.

I picked up what looks to be an early 1997 Legacy (3 bolt neck) finished in a well maintained translucent Forest Green. The aged pearl pickguard matched the finish wonderfully - though it was missing the tremelo cover. There was a lot of fret ware on the neck in the usual places, and some previous owner had replaced the bridge pickup with a hotrails humbucker - and wired it up like a Fender Strat (totally defeating the PTB wiring, and making the tones all weird because - well, these are not 250K pots here...but that is another story).

So I knew even as I bought it, I'd probably be spending some coin on the frets, and possibly even a new neck (which I didn't realize at the time would be quite the hassle it would eventually promise to be) - but for all that, I was happy to finally have a G&L in my collection.

I'll probably post something in the projects when I officially sit down to work on it. But for now I just wanted to tell the tale of how I came to be within the family of G&L enthusiasts.

I'm living up in Canada - have lived here all my life. I work as a computer programmer to pay the bills, and am one of the pastors in a local reformed church. Happily married with 5 kids, so I am pretty busy most of the time. Haven't been in a band in decades, but I still play daily. My tastes run from Albert King to Bob Marley to the Police, to SRV and Pink Floyd. I love the blues and older jazz, but don't mind listening to bands like Pearl Jam or 21 Pilots. I think I just like a good groove, wherever that is found. Tone wise, I gravitate to the cleaner tones like SRV or Gilmour, and play almost exclusively through my modified Blues junior - which has the benefit of sounding much bigger and boutique-ier than it has a right to, and is far more portable, which at my age is more of a factor than it was 30 years ago.

I've been reading the forum for months, but today I decided to join the conversation as it were, so I commend myself to you all, please take care of me.

Dan

Welcome, Dan!

It's great to have you join us and we look forward to seeing your Legacy, as probably you know, it does not exist without photos.
When you get a chance, please add it to our G&L Registry, too.

I'll eventually get around to taking (and posting) some pics. The only photo I have at the moment is one that I snapped at home on my way out the door just after finding this website, and thinking - I should see if my new Legacy is in their registry (and if not - I should add it!). I did just that several weeks back. It wasn't in the registry, so I added it at the time.

As I mentioned, I do plan on taking some more pictures - primarily when I get around to redoing the wiring, change one or more pups and add some some shielding. For now, at least you can see the "premium" translucent (forest green) finish, and the SN on the (black) 3 bolt plate with the G&L logo. I'm guessing it's an early 1997 from the SN and black 3 bolt plate - but I suppose it could be a 1996 as well.

Either way, this'll have to do for now. It does exist.

Welcome to the forum ! While it seems to be a lot quieter around here in the last few months there are many very knowledgeable G&L enthusiasts here. The knowledgebase is excellent. You will really enjoy that guitar once its back to spec.

Thanks glvourot!

It does seem a little quiet - but I was thinking that has to do with everyone being either at work or out shopping for the season. Having lost of fun just reading the forum posts from months gone by.

Welcome Dan! Looking forward to see more. And nice to see another of these infamous errant 3-bolt B-serial numbers pop up. Fits the period perfectly.

- Jos

Welcome Dan !!

Jos,
that looks like a 'G' to me

Welcome Dan !!

Jos,
that looks like a 'G' to me

Yes, this is correct. Here is the Registry entry which Dan added: G051680.

The 'B' guitar neck plates were in the following ranges (G&L Knowledgebase reference post: Serial number significance):

Note: Many 3-bolt guitar plates in the range 52000 to 55000 were mis-stamped with a B-prefix instead of the
usual G-prefix. It was a mistake and the plates were used rather than wasting them.

Welcome Dan

Lots of canadians on the site, with G&Ls. Where you at? I'm in niagara area, 15 minutes outside of the falls.

Alf

Yes, this is correct. Here is the Registry entry which Dan added: G051680.

Almost.. You have the SN correct in the text of the link - but in the URL itself you transposed the 6 and 8 (Your link actually points to G051860).

Here is my entry: G051680

@Alf - I'm over in Winnipeg. Weather has been positively balmy these last few days (-7 ish).

@everyone - thanks for the welcome, I've been reading through the forums, and like everything that matters - it's all about the tone - and the tone here is pretty good.

Hi Dan,

Welcome to the cult....uh I mean the club! Cool story of how you were lead to G&L. I have never owned a Heritage but owners always give them big raves. Will have to get my hands on one someday, just to see how they feel. Jump in often and let us know how yer Legacy progresses and post full pics when possible.

I've been to Winterpeg. But it was the summer time. I've also been to Regina when it was -40..............

I owned 2 Heritages. Being a lefty, I can't buy a Gibson as its hard to find a good one. Heritage is not a worry.

I had a 150 which I loved, bought it new, but it wasn't being played and was almost 11 pounds. Sold it to a guy in Toronto and its his main gigging guitar.

I also bought a used 535 which I still have and play a lot. Great guitars.

u can see them in my avatar

@Sam - If you ever see a Heritage guitar in a pawn shop or in the paper - try it out. They are almost always undervalued because few people know what they are worth. I could go on about them - but this isn't the place for that.

@Alf - I see them now! Nice bursts on both.

Welcome Dan! I love that green color. Most of my playing is at my church. I have some similar musical tastes. There's good music being made it just more work to find it. Lot of good grooves out there.

Cheers and welcome, Dan.

@WitSok - thanks man, and Merry Christmas! Like yourself, most of my playing is at church also.

I had decided upon a legacy prior to searching for a G&L in earnest - but when I did begin my search, it was the finish on this guitar that set it apart from the others. Few finishes go well with a pearl pickguard - but this finish accommodates pearl quite readily - giving a nice vintage feel to the look.

I finally got around to taking some pictures.

Here is a shot of the guitar in its case (mind the messy bed I have the case resting on), Note the tremolo cover? It didn't come with one, so I had to order that a couple of weeks back - it came in the mail yesterday! (Now I just need to figure out what length and size screws I need - feel free to add your wisdom here!):




Here is a closer look at the body:



The back has what looks to be a long, zig-zagging scar under the finish (see to the right of the top/right trem-cover screw-hole. It looks like someone was buffing it with a drill and dragged the center-piece from tremolo cover to tail zig-zagging as they went. Not sure how that got through quality control, but since it is on the back, it doesn't bother me too much. I hope the original owner got a discount for that.:



Here is the Headstock - note how gritty the nut is, and how deep the furrows are - I think someone wanted really low action - which probably is aggravating the fret-buzz between the 10th and 16th frets:



Here is a sideways shot of the nut to show the depth of these cuts a little better (yes, those are my out-of-focus plaid pajamas in the background):



Here is a closer look at the worst of the fretwear. Someone liked to play Em Pentatonics... alot!:



Finally, here is a shot of the back of the neck, along with a much clearer view of my messy bed, and my humble bookshelf:



As I mentioned earlier, I plan on redoing the wiring. The person who installed that SD Hotrails in the bridge wired it up like a Strat (PTB be damned aparently), so I plan to put that back right and proper, but I think I'll replace the hotrails with an SSL-6 I have on hand, and the middle pickup with an RWRP SSL-2 - I also plan to add some serious shielding while I'm in there. But before I tackle any of that I'll probably get the neck looked at. I'm thinking I can get away with a new nut, and a few new frets and this old girl will be ready for work.

Looks like it has the steel saddle upgrade as they appear darker / more mat than the rest of the chromed parts. Overall looks really good.

@WitSok - I noticed that the saddles were darker, and wondered about that. Now I want to look into that!

I knew the finish and pick guard were premier options, but I wasn't sure about anything else. Looking at the marbling of the maple in the neck, it's a shame they didn't go with an all maple neck. I think it would have looked even better. That may just be my preference for maple fretboards speaking. I don't mind rosewood - both would look sharp with this particular finish and pick guard.

At this point, I am just hoping the neck isn't going to cost me too much to bring back to spec. If this was a Strat, I'd already have a new neck on it, but as after-market necks are hard to come by (especially three bolt ones!), I'll just have to get someone to do the work for me. I mentioned earlier that because of the fret buzz around the twelfth fret it doesn't play well, but that was something was aware of before I bought it (and the price I paid for it - about half the average asking price on eBay for same year/model- reflected this).

I'm really hoping that in a month or two I'll have her up to par. I ordered a very slick looking green leather strap from Amazon - with Celtic embossing, that I think will really compliment it. I'm so looking forward to putting it all together!

Welcome, Dan.

I went through the same kind of discovery you did with with Heritage and G&L guitars. When I was much younger, in 1979, I had bought a Les Paul Custom, thinking that was going to be one of those ultimate guitars. Luckily, even earlier, in 1976, I had bought a Yamaha SG1500 when I was actually shopping for a Les Paul Custom. Over the decades of the 70s and 80s I kept going back and forth between the 2 guitars (among other ones) and finally decided that I don't need or care for the LP. I sold it on eBay in 2005.

I do have one Fender, it is a 1975 Stratocaster hardtail that was the first electric guitar that I bought with money I earned. My other guitar makes are (aforementioned) Yamaha, G&L, Godin, Heritage (535), Melancon, and a Daisy Rock (12-string). These are culled from how I like them and not from any name recognition. I am happy with my decisions.

Hi Dan,

I went through a couple of Fenders over the years, and don't regret selling any of them. The only one I still own is a bass I cobbled together from the surviving bits of other players' fail attempts at modding back in the early '80s. Both of my sons have short-scale Fender basses, due to the price/quality ratio rather than the headstock decal. I just traded away the only Gibson guitar I've owned (an ES-120T), and don't think I will regret that either. I do kick myself for dragging my feet and missing a Heritage bass a couple of years ago. I haven't seen another one for sale since then.

If you're just looking at a new nut and partial or full refret, the price should be less than sourcing a replacement neck. I don't have much experience with BBE-era G&Ls, but the nut on yours looks to be a different material than the ones on my '96-'97 ASAT Classic Custom and late '90s basses. Yours may have been replaced by a previous owner, or could have been a factory option.

In the '80s the back cover screws were the same as control plates and pick guards. You could confirm this by testing with one of your pick guard mounting screws. They should be easy to find a match for at a hardware store, or by ordering from somewhere like Stew Mac.

I can't tell for sure from the photo, but the mark on the back of the body might be natural figuring in the wood. It reminds me of figuring in a couple of swamp ash ASATs I have from '87.

Ken

@Kit - thanks for the welcome! Life is funny that way. Gibson guitars became a brand name because their guitars were well built, high quality items. Once their brand was established it seemed to take on a momentum that was no longer linked to quality - but rather to popularity - a trend that seems to be more pronounced as the years go on (at least to this observer). I realized at some point that I didn't want a Gibson Les Paul for the actual guitar, but just because it "was" a Gibson Les Paul. It took a while even after realizing this, to get to the place where I truly couldn't care less about the name - as long as the instrument itself was something I valued both in quality of build, ease of play, aesthetics and sound. It's also a lot easier on the ol' pocket book.

@KenC - That's a good idea about the pickguard screws. I've peeked at the holes in the back and they look a little stripped. I'm guessing some owner along the way was a little heavy handed in tightening the tremolo cover, and stripped the holes - causing the cover to become too loose to keep on. I'll probably end up doweling and re-drilling the holes. It's a bother, but I prefer that to just finding larger screws.

About that mark to the right of the Tremolo on the back - I want to believe that it is a naturally occurring blemish, but this isn't a marbling or a discoloration or some odd play in the grain - this is something that cuts across the grain without any interplay between itself and the grain. naturally occurring blemishes... look "natural" because they blend in with the wood - this doesn't smell like that at all. I'll take a much closer look at it if I remember, and try and get a good picture of it. Maybe someone has seen something like this naturally occurring before?

Looks like it has the steel saddle upgrade as they appear darker / more mat than the rest of the chromed parts. Overall looks really good.

I'd bet they are graph-tech saddles.
Pretty green legacy!

I'd bet they are graph-tech saddles.
Pretty green legacy!

Being new to G&L instruments, I just assumed they were standard fare - but they certainly look like graph-tech saddles, and frankly, they look newer/sharper than the rest of the bridge. I'd say you're right - and now I know that graph-tech Saddles are a thing, as I googled them to see what they were all about. Lot of good testimonies (+tone/+sustain) etc. I thought - hey! this sounds like a win for me!

I keep going back and forth on green guitars. Sometimes I think yuck, a green guitar. But yours looks really sharp and I'm now back to liking green. Maybe it depends on the shape or the rest of the parts and how they work with that color.

I do see Legacy necks on Ebay or Reverb from time to time, It's a very popular guitar and many have been produced so you may luck out one day and find one. I have a Nighthawk with a nut problem like yours. Previous owner liked to string it with 11s and I like 9s better so the grooves are too deep to really get it working just how I like it. You can barely slip a piece of paper under the first fret. I need to find a trustworthy Luthier that can replace the nut in this area. I feel my woodworking skills are pretty good and I could replace and file a new nut no problem. I am just afraid I would damage something getting the old one off. maybe I'll watch some U-tube videos and see how hard it really is.

But, looks like a good score for you and I do love it in green, the saddles do look black and I don't think G&L ever used black saddles.
Welcome to the group and do keep us updated on your progress.

Tom

I feel my woodworking skills are pretty good and I could replace and file a new nut no problem. I am just afraid I would damage something getting the old one off. maybe I'll watch some U-tube videos and see how hard it really is.

Tom,

I've noticed on a couple of my early G&Ls that the nuts weren't firmly attached anymore. If you take the strings off you might be able just to shift it out with finger pressure, or a light tap or two from the side with a nail punch. I assume they were glued in at the factory, so applying a little bit of heat to the nut might break the bond as well.

Ken

Thanks Tom. I share your love/hate approach to green guitars. A good friend of mine (back in 90' or 91' I think it was) purchased a brand new "Eric Clapton" signature series Stratocaster. According to my friend - who likely got this from the sales staff at the time, Fender approached Eric Clapton with the prospect of creating a signature series using one of his guitars. He suggested they copy "Blackie" - his favorite at the time, but asked that they not release the copy in the original color - but rather in three other colors - Ferrari Red, 7up Green, and Charcoal Grey. The guitar my friend purchased was in 7UP Green, and frankly, I wasn't really impressed by the color. It had a white, single-ply pickguard, an all maple neck, and a small head-stock - and looked nice enough - for a green guitar - but I just didn't "feel" it like he did.

Yet when I was looking to pick up Legacy - I kept coming back to this one because the whole package seemed to work so well. I don't know if I'd like the same color set if I found it on any other guitar - but it really worked (for me at least) with this one.

yours is a beauty and I love the hum bucker in the bridge. Graphtec stuff is great. I ordered a nut online from them and it fit in perfectly and easily. My asat special was ordered with a graphtec nut. Was great. Good products.

I bet the neck is really fast. Sometimes, G&L has necks on their parts site, rarely, but sometimes. I bought 2 Tribute necks that way and have them ready for a project guitar sometime.

[Craig]

There is a Legacy three bolt neck on Ebay right now. It's a 2000 USA built with Forewood board.

Code:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/G-L-2000-USA-Rosewood-Legacy-Neck-/401254339982?hash=item5d6c9f558e:g:TkMAAOSwA3dYbUJe

Check it out, maybe worthwhile.

Tom

Last edited by Craig on Sat Jun 17, 2017 10:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: ebay links are not safe to post as links.

There is a Legacy three bolt neck on Ebay right now. It's a 2000 USA built with Forewood board.

Code:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/G-L-2000-USA-Rosewood-Legacy-Neck-/401254339982?hash=item5d6c9f558e:g:TkMAAOSwA3dYbUJe

Check it out, maybe worthwhile.

Tom

must be a replacement neck for a 3 bolt made in 2000
rosewood is cheaper to refret than maple , I would pick out your favorite fret wire size and go stainless

I'd bet they are graph-tech saddles.
Pretty green legacy!

Lot of good testimonies (+tone/+sustain) etc. I thought - hey! this sounds like a win for me!

I had some graph-tech saddles on a strat for awhile. I wasn't sure if it sounded better, maybe, but i definitely broke less strings! I think stock G&L saddles are pretty nice. Was never impressed with the Fenders.

There is a Legacy three bolt neck on Ebay right now. It's a 2000 USA built with Forewood board.

Code:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/G-L-2000-USA-Rosewood-Legacy-Neck-/401254339982?hash=item5d6c9f558e:g:TkMAAOSwA3dYbUJe

Check it out, maybe worthwhile.

Tom

I totally missed this.. (imagine an unspeakably sad faced emoji here). I had a long weekend this weekend, and didn't see this until this morning. the neck has already sold - but from the listing, I certainly would have bid on it.

Snoozing and losing, my old companions, have once again conspired to deprive me of fair booty. Sigh.

Sorry you missed it Dan. Like I said though, I do see them fairly often on that site. I will say though that this particular seller is somewhat well known for taking good, working guitars and parting them out as they can fetch more as parts than as a complete instrument. Nothing really wrong with that and making a profit and all, but when you take a G&L out of circulation it feels bad in this community. On the bright side, it makes all our G&Ls more valuable.

Better luck next time, I'll post if I see another.

Tom

I hear ya Tom, and thanks.

[Craig]

Hey Dan, you still looking for a Legacy neck? Checkout this one on EBAY. It's for sale by the same guy as the last one.

Code:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/G-L-1996-USA-Rosewood-Legacy-Neck/201809912570?_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D41375%26meid%3D1e4e00b9347f49bb89ca1efa5543f15b%26pid%3D100011%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D401254339982

Tom

Last edited by Craig on Sat Jun 17, 2017 10:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: ebay links are not safe to post as links.

Congratulations and I love that green. Its aged beautifully actually. Nice!

Tom, Thanks for the link! I am now entering into the "justifying the expenditure to myself" phase of consideration. It's always nasty (to me at least) when something is priced smack-dab in the middle of the "too dear to just buy, too necessary to ignore" zone.

(context: presently the Canadian Dollar is only buying 69 US cents, which means with shipping that puppy comes in at $450! - The pain! The indecision!)

Gothink1 - There were two legacy guitars I was looking at when this one came up - and it was the finish that really decided it for me - it is just a great classic look.

SideNote: After setting up the neck a little more properly, the former buzz is alleviated. I think a professional could probably improve on my adjustments though, and several of the frets will need to be replaced, as well as the nut whom a former owner was a little too generous in augmenting (to lower the string action). I plan to change the string gauge as well, so it'll need to go regardless. Buying a new neck would solve all of that at once, but I could probably get away with fixing all the problems for less than half the price of a new neck, so I am still playing with the idea.

Anyone near you have a PLEK machine? Probably not but that would likely cost less then 450 I would think. even if you buy the new neck you will still have some costs to set it up.

Good luck

Tom

[Craig]

Dan,

Here's another Legacy neck. A couple bucks cheaper.

Code:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/G-L-1995-USA-Legacy-Neck-/282374405378?hash=item41bed37d02:g:iYMAAOSwB-1YsfeO

Tom

Last edited by Craig on Sat Jun 17, 2017 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: ebay links are not safe to post as links.

missed it.

missed it.

Dan, I'm trying to help you out here...Ya gotta jump on these things. The other one on there is a hundred bucks more and probably the same thing. I wouldn't be surprised if if the one guy with the more expensive one bought this one and you will see it back up for sale for a lot more.

Oh well...I'll Keep looking

Tom

missed it.

Dan, I'm trying to help you out here...Ya gotta jump on these things. The other one on there is a hundred bucks more and probably the same thing. I wouldn't be surprised if if the one guy with the more expensive one bought this one and you will see it back up for sale for a lot more.

Oh well...I'll Keep looking

Tom

It's great that you want to help Dan, but it would have been quicker to EMAIL him instead of posting a personal message to him here.
Not all members visit this site on a daily basis so an EM would be quickest.

missed it.

Dan, I'm trying to help you out here...Ya gotta jump on these things. The other one on there is a hundred bucks more and probably the same thing. I wouldn't be surprised if if the one guy with the more expensive one bought this one and you will see it back up for sale for a lot more.

Oh well...I'll Keep looking

Tom

It's great that you want to help Dan, but it would have been quicker to EMAIL him instead of posting a personal message to him here.
Not all members visit this site on a daily basis so an EM would be quickest.

Well maybe they should...it's a great site.

I'll maybe do both next time.

Tom