Wednesday's rainy day weather lunch report

Today's late, late lunch is going to be the remainder of the Christmas dinner leftovers (then I'm sure next week will be New Year's Day Dinner leftovers ).

Kudos to all of you who responded to these posts. I am getting some interesting information and a few myths "busted" at the same time.

Before I get to the G&L question, I thought about something last week with Gary's posts and the responses generated over the call for pics of the cool engines on wheels. I've known more than a few people who are not only guitar aficionados, but like their firearms as well. Without getting into the psychology of men and guitars, cars and guns , I was just curious as to who might also have a collection, however small or extensive, of firearms. I'm not asking for pictures (unless you want to o course - and it doesn't violate any forum rules), but like I said, I'm just curious. I have a few choice handguns - my Sig P229 .40 is one I would never be without - and a Dragunov (Soviet style) sniper rifle with the older style wood furniture (http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&expI ... 62&bih=555 and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dragunov_sniper_rifle). Unfortunately, my best rifles were stolen in a home invasion while I was at work when I lived in a different city in a bad area. Who knows, there may be some Ted Nugent types out there in forumland. (Responsible gun owners, I mean... )

Now for the G&L question: I've read a number of comments from various points of view regarding the 3-bolt neck in comparison to the 4-bolt. It was my understanding from somewhere on the forum that the 4-bolt came about to make guitar dealers happy because they said it was harder to sell them after the bad rep the 3-bolt Fenders got. But, why the change happened isn't so much my concern as what the change did to the overall tone and sustain of the guitars. My S-500 is one of the last 3-bolts - from what I can guess about the year is was made (1996-98) and most of the time I see a WTB listing the would-be buyer requests a 3-bolt. Is this because they are worth more or because the tighter fit of neck to body really does give them more of the holy sustain we all want? Or, is this too a myth that needs a bit of "busting"?

Like I've said many times, my S-500 is without question the most amazingly versatile and incredible sounding guitar I've ever owned with the strat-style body I have become [insert word that means "way more than accustomed to"]. The old exaggerated expression about a note "ringing for days" certainly applies to her, and I have to wonder how much of the tight fitting neck has to do with that (if the rumor is in fact true).

So what's the word folks, do the 3-bolt necks help the sustain and overall sound of the guitars they were used on, or is this just hype and/or wishful thinking on the part of purists or others like myself who trust that if Fullerton or Fender thought it was the best method to use, then it's the best method to use?

A bit of clarification for all of those who own 4-bolt necks for any reason - e.g., that was the only type available when you bought your G&L - I am not trying to cast any negative thoughts about your guitar. I am hoping to hear from those who either own or have played both and have formed an opinion one way or another, or even stayed neutral because the number of bolts were never an issue that crossed their minds.

Phillip

I don't collect guns, I have a few handguns for work and a couple of old 22 rifles for plinking as I don't hunt anymore. George Fullerton liked his guns althougth I don't know if he collected, Tim would know. This is a favorite pic of Mr. Fullerton that Tim posted along with others from his memorial.



As far as three or four bolts go I don't care as long as the pocket is tight, the old three bolts did have very tight pockets. A lot of times what someone means by 3 bolt in an add is thier looking for a leo era guitar,(even tho 3 bolts were used by BBE up till 1997) The 3 bolt Leo era guitars pre 91, are more sought after by collectors and do go up in value.

gary

No guns here. But I'm a mofo with a long, hard stick. And one on one... I prefer Shane Carwin's style. (Also, the "Nuge" is, IMHO, an ignoramus.)

3 vs 4 bolts? This is an OCD guitar question. Guitars are fickle, because they're made out of wood (I don't foresee a carbon fiber argument in this group). Great electric guitars happen because of luck: the right combination of individual wood pieces and electronics. That's why paying a zillion dollars for a old Les Paul is ludicrous. Out of the batch made there were a few great ones, a bunch of good ones, and a batch of duds. It's the same with every guitar model. No modern manufacturer has the time, money, or inclination to make every instrument a Stradivarius. So... there are super fine 3 bolt G&Ls and super fine 4 bolts--none of which has anything to do with the number of bolts.


Yeehaw! (Sorry, just having a little fun with an old school G&LDP reply .)

--GDub

I have one each of 3-bolt and 4-bolt G&L and I can't say that I find either superior to the other in terms of stability or sustain. In both the G&L and old Fenders the 3-bolt is coupled with the micro-tilt feature. As you know the micro-tilt is to allow you to adjust the angle of the neck to the body which allows you more latitude in string action adjust. I can see that if the micro-tilt bolt is used to set the neck angle that it can reduce the area of contact between the neck butt and the neck pocket, and that can presumably affect sustain. I also have a 3-bolt 1975 Fender Strat, but I have not had to use the micro-tilt for neck angle in either my Fender or my G&L. So any theory about effect on sustain cannot be verifiable for me.

I have several bolt-on neck guitars and I have honestly never had problem with stability or sustain issues with any of these guitars.

As far as guns are concerned, I don't have any and doubt that I ever will.

Kit

I'm 40 years old and have never even FIRED a gun, never mind owned one. Don't see starting anytime soon. Besides, how can one afford two habits like guns AND guitars. I mean, my marriage is already threatened by GAS. Guns might start giving her ideas!

I've played 3-bolt and 4-bolt, and I feel like the 3-bolt has more mojo (probably because the older guitars tend to anyway). But no real difference IMO.

Sonically, I'm fully behind GDub claims and do not believe there is an innate difference between 3-bolt and 4-bolt. But if you want to make a picture of the neck date and/or pocket date, a 4-bolt is 'one more' (think Nigel Tuffnel)

As far as guns go, a a Dutchman the whole phenomenon is weird ...

- Jos

As far as guns go, a a Dutchman the whole phenomenon is weird ...

Ditto here - none of that sort of thing in Australia either, not since a certain madman went berserk and killed a lot of people. I admire guns for the craftsmanship, they're very nice things to behold, such precision.

3 and 4 bolt - I like the look of the 3 bolt more, plus the adjustment for pitch of the neck is pretty neat, not that I've ever had to use it

I have a seven and nine year old boys running around and exploring every nook and cranny of our home, so no guns.

I own both three and four-bolt G&L guitars. Of my two favorites, one is a three and one is a four. I'm with gw and others on this one, though having the ability to tweak the neck angle (three bolts) is a nice feature for set-up purposes, though I can count on two fingers the number of times I've felt compelled to make such an adjustment. - ed

It was my understanding from somewhere on the forum that the 4-bolt came about to make guitar dealers happy because they said it was harder to sell them after the bad rep the 3-bolt Fenders got.

That would be in the G&L Knowledgebase, General G&L Questions sub-forum: When and why did G&L switch to a four-bolt neck?

I don't have a preference on the number of bolts or if it has the Precision Tilt adjustment. I do like the new necks, though, because they are Plek'd and you can choose from a list of standard shapes and sizes.

I don't have a preference for 3 or 4 bolts. I own both, and both are setup beautifully--without any adjustment on my part. I am really having to rethink things that I thought I 'knew' about my neck preferences. I have an ASAT deluxe, and the seller misrepresented the neck that was on the guitar. It is 1 5/8 nut, 7.5 radius. Which I am very familiar, but it is very chunky and I am really starting to like it. I don't find that I like the thinner ones less, it just somehow feels 'good'. I still am not quite as sharp with it as the thinner ones I have played for ever. I bend strings a little sharp on chords I am less familiar with, etc. But it is coming, and I just love the feel of the whole instrument.

I am wanting to try a flatter wider neck. I have been thinking about ordering a new G&L Bluesboy with a wider config, then if I really don't like the neck I could just replace the 4 bolt with a new one, and sell the old one.

I like the way the 3 bolt looks and the micro tilt is a cool feature but I prefer the feel and profile choices on the newer 4 bolt necks.

As for guns, I have never owned one but I have fired .22's and a .50 cal black powder musket. My wife isn't fond of them and I already have a couple of expensive hobbies. That Dragunov rifle looks awesome!

-Dave

No guns here. But I'm a mofo with a long, hard stick. And one on one... I prefer Shane Carwin's style. (Also, the "Nuge" is, IMHO, an ignoramus.)

Yeehaw! (Sorry, just having a little fun with an old school G&LDP reply .)

--GDub

I'd give an old school reply to your old school reply but I don't wanna get in any trouble before I get my lunch reporter pedal, so quit pickin on the Nuge

peace

No guns here. But I'm a mofo with a long, hard stick. And one on one... I prefer Shane Carwin's style. (Also, the "Nuge" is, IMHO, an ignoramus.)

Yeehaw! (Sorry, just having a little fun with an old school G&LDP reply .)

--GDub

I'd give an old school reply to your old school reply but I don't wanna get in any trouble before I get my lunch reporter pedal, so quit pickin on the Nuge

peace

The "Nuge" is an opportunist making bank off his "wacko-ness." If we met him he'd probably come off as being a nice guy--just an old school rocker (and family man) trying to keep his thing going. And no doubt he's that. How he chose to keep it going is my issue. So, for me, he's fair game.



Feckin' ridiculous.

--GDub