Tubes!!!

One of my favorite topics

I just scored some tubes off of CL that included; a matched pair of "winged C" 6L6's, 10 12ax7's (mostly EH, but there was a GE, RCA, and two Japanese made ones in there too), 3 12at7's (2 chinese, 1 RCA), a couple 12au7's (have so many I don't even care what it was), and 9 6bq5/el84's (6 sovteks, and 3 Japanese Realistics)

all for $25!

I bought them because they were cheap and I like trying different tubes out, I was hoping for a little more brand variety but overall a good score. Really wanted to try out those 6L6's as I've heard they sound similar to the old Sylvania's which I had but they recently died, at $80/pair new they're not really in the experiment price range.

So far power tube wise in my current amp (Bandmaster) I've had Sylvania's, TAD short bottles, Jan Philips wgb's, and Sed winged C's.
Preamp - I've had sovtek lps , tung-sol reissue, a mullard, GE longplates, JAN GE 5751.
PI - guy I got the amp from had a Groove tubes at7 (Sovtek) in there, I replaced it with a NOS Mullard which are still reasonably priced (~$30)

I'll right up a review when I get a chance to try out different combo's this weekend.

How about you guys, any good scores lately, any new production tubes stand out to you? What were some of your favorite old stock tubes you've loved and lost or are still kickin'?

-Dave

Damn that's cheap! I'd love to hear your thoughts on them Japanese EL-84s. I've had such bad luck with current production ones recently.

I don't have an amp that runs el84's at the moment, though I've convinced myself that somehow I will be getting one soon, where there's a will there's a way

If I don't end up using them I'll send you a couple.

Also if anyone needs 12au7's (lowenders?) I have quite a few 1960's Raytheon's and RCA clear tops hanging around that I will probably never use, they are not new but they all work. If anyone wants to cover shipping I'll send you a few.

-Dave

If I don't end up using them I'll send you a couple.

Sweet! I'll exchange a few packets of Tim Tams for them

Jamie, Sounds like a deal! I'll keep you posted

Spent about an hour messing with preamp tubes today left the amp settings neutral, bass 6 treble 6 (that's all I got)
Here's what I tried out:
12AX7's

60's GE long plates: Very balanced, clear tone not as complex as the mullard(not reissue) I had in there at one point but still very good. I put this one first because it is really what I consider the middle ground on everything I tested.

RCA 7025: Again nicely balanced like the GE but noticeably brighter, which I really liked, this one ended up in V1. It was a tough choice between this and the GE. The GE landed V2 and I jumper the inputs so it still lends it's tonal flavor.

Realistic(Japan): I had two of these tubes one had 4 seams on the top glass indicating it was from the <censored word> plant(set up by Mullard) the other had two seams and the plate structure was slightly different. Both tubes sounded excellent and I'd have loved to keep them in there but unfortunately both were noisy. It would cut in and out and after several tests it only happened with those two tubes, real shame.

JAN GE 5751: I bought this a while ago and have never really bonded with it in my amp. It's a much darker sounding tube, than anything I've tried. Not in a bad way, but it just doesn't fit my tastes. I think in a different amp that is maybe a bit shrill it would be fantastic.

Tung-sol Reissue: Not a bad option for new production, a lot better sounding than what most amps come with stock. It's musical sounding but a bit unbalanced. Highs can get harsh and lows a little boom-y but remember I left the amp at a neutral setting, I'm sure with some tweaking of the amp's eq I could have found a decent balance.

Electro-Harmonix: Made in the same factory as the Tung-sol RI. Plate structures are very similar, if not identical, only differences I noticed were a slightly different coating on the plates and a different getter. Despite those differences they sound remarkable similar with the EH being a little darker than the Tung-sol RI. I was pleased to see that these new production tubes could hang with the "Old Stock". Were they as good, no, but they were not so bad that it would warrant going out and spending 6-8 times as much on NOS.

12AT7's

Mullard CV4024: I bought this one, it was still what I consider reasonable and it's a tube that will hopefully last a very long time. Great sounding tube in the PI, blows away the sovtek that was in there. More musical, more detail great balance, just adds a nice lively-ness to the amp.

Unknown: just got this in my purchase the other day, still haven't figured out who makes it since most of the writing/symbols are gone. The plate structure is odd, it looks very much like a normal at7 but one end on each plate has depth to it with three holes punched in the plate, rather than being crimped flat. Whatever it is, it is every bit as wonderful as the Mullard. I had a hard time choosing between the two but I stuck with the Mullard. It had the tiniest bit more harmonics, it would be in-perceivable if I weren't sitting in front of the speaker in a closed room. I'll update when I figure out what it is.

Final configuration V1: RCA 7025 V2: GE long plate V3: GE long plate PI: Mullard CV4024

So that's it so far, power tubes are next but that requires re-biasing so it may take me a while. I may just swap them around, if they don't red plate it's fine

-Dave


*Disclaimer: These are just my thoughts from what I tried with my rig. You may get different results with your own rig. I play loud music in a band so my ability to pick out certain intricacies may be compromised. In short YMMV

Hi Dave,

Thanks for posting this comparison. I found it really interesting, mainly because it is nigh on impossible to get NOS tubes out here in Oz.

I'll send you some packs of Iced Vovo's for the JAN GE 5751 if you want to offload them

My Vox AC15 is VERY bright on the Top Boost channel. Your description of the JAN GE 5751 sounds exactly like what I need. I've got some JJ's in there at the moment. They're good tubes as far as modern production types go, but they're on the bright side. At least they're quiet and reliable.

Well, since the topic is tubes and the like... Here is a great bookmark to read at your leisure.

http://www.tone-lizard.com/Electronic_Parts.htm

I bought some tubes from these guys, great quick service too.

http://thetubestore.com/

Thanks for the links glv!

I've read through a lot of info on that tone-lizard site before, he makes a lot of good points on things and I agree with him on the shear lunacy surrounding NOS tubes/caps/transformers etc. He posts a lot of info saying tubes shouldn't sound any different or better and while I would never pay $200/tube for NOS RCA Blackplates(unless I won the lottery ) I do hear a difference in the old stock tubes. It's usually more of a tonal balance though, some just seem to not let highs and/or lows get out of hand better, or will have a darker or brighter tonality. I have never tried OS tubes in a new amp though, I've only ever used them in the two vintage Fenders I had/have ('72 bassman, '66 bandmaster) so maybe that's part of it. Like how the Boogie Mark series amps were designed around the Sylvania 6L6 str 415/387, certain tubes just react better with certain circuits

Also, it's good to mention I've paid for very few OS tubes, or new tubes for that matter. My best source so far has been old organs, a lot of people give them away or leave them on the side of the road, most contain at least 2 power tubes, a rectifier, a few 12ax7's and a TON of 12au7's along with some various other tube types. The best part is they usually have vintage alnico speakers, the last one I got had a pair of Jensen P10r's from the 60's sold the pair for about $100, and if one didn't have a rip in the cone I'd have gotten more. Some people look down upon it but the way I see it is the instrument is headed to the dump might as well recycle as much as you can, it is a LOT of work though. There are a lot of organs out there that do not have tubes in them though, do your best to research the model before you go to pick it up.

-Dave

Well I ended up just plugging in some different power tubes without re-biasing(Gods be damned)...I know I know, not the best idea, but these old Fenders just don't seem to care, and I was very careful to watch for red plating. Still not ideal sound wise, who knows if they're running hot or cold, oh well it was fun so don't take the following reviews too seriously.

70's Sylvania 6L6gc(not str/7581) - This is the first old stock tube I tried in my amp, they came out of the '72 Bassman I had and were probably the original tubes that came with that amp. These sound fantastic! Balanced, lots of harmonics, good headroom. Bass never seems to get boom-y, but is full; highs are pleasant and not harsh. These unfortunately are on their way out which started this whole tube search, NOS runs around $100/tube.

JAN Philips 6L6wgb - I bought these because they are somewhere in between a 6L6 and a 5881. They work well in 6v6 amps to give more headroom and in 6L6 amps to give less. With these in my amp I start getting breakup around 3 1/2 - 4 as opposed to 5 1/2 -6 with the sylvania's. These have a bit darker/bass-ier clean tone to them, they break up very nicely into crunchy/gritty goodness As much as I like the break up on these, they barely leave enough clean headroom to get over my drummer(who plays very loud) I have to note though that I've only tried them with my 1x15 cab which has a less efficient speaker in it, might work really well with my 2x10.

TAD 6L6wgc-str(short bottles)- These are what I generally leave in my amp right now, they have a nice tone to them, maybe a tad(pun intended) brighter than the sylvania's, but the bass can be boom-y. They give a good mount of headroom, breakup isn't quite as nice as the sylvania's or the JAN but they do the job, they are relatively cheap and they've been a work horse for me.

SED Winged =C= 6L6gc - I've been hearing great things about these for few years and they've only gone up in price. I did notice a little bit of red plate action which really limited my testing, but what I heard I liked. A nicer tone than the TAD's overall. Still a bit bass-y compared to the JAN and Sylvania's, not as much as the TAD's. If I were buying new tubes I don't think I'd pay the $80, the TAD's aren't that far off and almost half the price and there are a lot of other offerings I'd be interested in trying.

One of these weeks when I'm not working 60hrs I'll open the bandmaster up re-bias for the SED's, fix that damn tremolo and re-evaluate my thoughts on them.

Until then, happy tubing !

-Dave